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Author Topic: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)  (Read 12590 times)

Offline pudding

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TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« on: July 13, 2017, 09:47:55 pm »
So what is this brace thing all about then?

Simply put, it ties the two turrets together with rigid bars.

Why do I need that then?

Well, you don't really.  It's just one of those 'nice to haves' to fine tune the chassis feel and responsiveness.

If we do some basic analysis, the best analogy I can come up with is a cardboard box.  An empty box is structurally very floppy.  Put some bracing in it, such as wine bottle dividers for example, and then it immediately becomes significantly more rigid.  The same theory applies to cars.  This is why saloons are so much more rigid than hatchbacks, because they have a big piece of sheet metal welded between the turrets.

OK, that sounds interesting, but why does it matter?

When you load a car up driving hard into a corner, hatchbacks have a tendency to twist because the rear of the car has no bracing.  The front turrets are braced by the firewall (plus other crash related strengthening), so a front brace is way less significant.  With the bulk of the weight at the front, along with a more rigid front structure, plus the length of the car....it's one heck of a long length of metal to try and remain stiff and planted in the bends.

This manifests itself as the rear end feeling a bit lazy, and the rear axle is just along for the ride instead of actively contributing to propping the car up in the corners.  One way of curing this is to fit a fatter rear roll bar, or stiffer rear springs, which then gives the car a more oversteery bias.  The car then feels more neutral in the corners, like both axles are flatter and more in-tune with each other.  Turn-in also improves. But the fatter arb still has a soggy rear end to deal with - think house foundations.  The more solid, the better.

Hmmmmm, you're losing me now, yawn, get to the point.

OK, so when a rear wheel hits a bump, or if one side loads up.....there is a vertical force applied to the strut tower.  Newton's 3rd law - every force has an equal and opposite reactive force.  Guess what the opposing force is?  The strut structure trying to move upwards in harmony with the damper/spring, which tries to bend the bodyshell accordingly.  The brace bars send that opposing force over to it's partner in crime on the other side of the car, so the forces balance each other out.

Ah OK, gotcha, so these little bars really work huh?

Yep!  More so on my old MK4 R32.  I've seen stronger blancmanges than that bodyshell.  The effect of a rear brace was so profound on that platform, it felt like I'd fitted a bigger rear ARB.

Yeah, whatever, what about the MK5, does it have the same affect?

Absolutely!  The MK5 was blessed with a 200% stiffer shell than the MK4, yep, 200%.  Marque to marque updates are usually in the order 30% stiffer, but VW really went to town on the MK5.  But none the less, the bracing does still have a noticeable effect.  MK5s are 12 years old now after all.

Does this man ever shut up? Get to the unboxing, pics and test drive already!!

The Americans know how to package a product. I chucked the box, but it was super tough and within it were these nicely packaged tasty parts....



Unbagged, the beauty of construction unfolds.... it really is nicely made stuff!



And here it is fitted into the car...



Wow, looks sexy, was it hard to fit?

Not at all.  Here is TyrolSport's instruction video, so have a gander and see for yourself -


No drilling, say what?? There must be a catch, surely?

Well, yeah there is.  Due to the brace being a generic product for both MK5 & MK6, some trimming of the plastics may be required.  Mine needed a bit of trimming, but bothered I am not because A) they're cheap to replace if selling the car on, and B) it's the back of the car where you put shopping and schitt, so who cares right?  My main concern was drilling.  In 2017, modifications of this type should not require drilling if it's a well thought out product....and drilling is irreversible, replacing plastic trims is no biggy.

The trimming is so subtle that most people would be hard pushed to notice it anyway.  I bet you're thinking "What's he actually trimmed?"  Exactly  :smiley:





Stop it already, I can feel my wallet twitching.  How much?

Hmmmm....well....that is the biggest drawback, coz it ain't cheap!  I paid $489 for the stage 2 wrinkle coated aluminium bar kit + $65 USPS shipping. £428.  Customs and handling fees at the UK end were £32, bringing it to a grand total of £460.  Before you shout "Are you fricking nuts???" at the screen, firstly, the quality has to be seen to be believed and secondly, no one in the UK had one, or even seemed remotely interested in getting one for me....and thirdly, one UK supplier used to list it at £500 + shipping, but no longer list it.  So I saved a bit by importing it myself, and got it just as quick as a UK supplier could.

For those still with me, they also do a carbon fibre option which is mega rigid, but mega money.  The aluminium bars are decent enough for a daily imo  :smiley:

Yeah I'm feeling it, but not feeling the price, is it worth it?

For the sheer bling factor, absolutely imo.  Who doesn't like motorsport inspired posh looking bars in their boot?  :grin:  But seriously, the brace kit does make a tangible difference on the road.  On the first test drive, I immediately noticed less creaking from the door seals when driving down drop kerbs, less squeaking and grumbling from the back over bumps and the first corner I hit....wow....it felt like I'd gone up a mm in rear ARB size as I mentioned earlier.

So yeah, this is definitely form AND function.  Very expensive granted, but for those who want an easily reversible hatch brace with no drilling, I can't think of a better product currently available.  Obviously nothing will beat a welded in cage, but this a nice, neat and subtle solution for anyone wanting to stiffen up their shell a bit  :happy2:


2007 ED30 | 2009 TDI 140 | 2016 BMW 330D

Offline Tfsi_Mike

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #1 on: July 13, 2017, 10:06:22 pm »
Good review buddy.

Probably not substantial enough to mount harnesses around, would you say?

Offline MIJ_JAGGER

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2017, 12:42:55 am »
So 460 quidies for a couple of mop sticks and some ikea brackets?

Only kidding mate, good work

Offline Shoduchi

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2017, 12:26:59 pm »
Due to the price I don't think a few holes in the shell of my car will matter much. I'd love to get this rear brace but not feeling the price is worth it compared with other rear braces available. :thinking:

Offline pudding

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2017, 12:37:52 pm »
Good review buddy.

Probably not substantial enough to mount harnesses around, would you say?

Hell no mate, defo not strong enough for that. Different kind of forces.  You'd need a welded or bolted in steel half cage for that I reckon.


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Offline pudding

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2017, 12:38:49 pm »
So 460 quidies for a couple of mop sticks and some ikea brackets?

Only kidding mate, good work

 :grin:  That's pretty much the sum of it  :happy2:



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Offline pudding

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2017, 12:43:12 pm »
Due to the price I don't think a few holes in the shell of my car will matter much. I'd love to get this rear brace but not feeling the price is worth it compared with other rear braces available. :thinking:

Go for it mate!  The Unibrace is a good one, or what ever you can get your hands on.   The only trouble with drilling and nutserts is you have to be very precise, otherwise the holes might not line up and it'll look a mess or not work quite as it should.

I like the Tyrol one because it attaches to very strong anchor points on the car.  It is a really neat solution, but too expensive if I'm honest.  It does work though  :smiley:

You could probably come up with a similar design yourself for significantly less money.  I thought about a welded in brace, which I can do myself, but I do need to fold the seats down occasionally.


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willni

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2017, 09:21:41 pm »
Great review and very tempting, If i were to use fluorescent tube lights and wired them instead of the tyrol kit could I get extra street cred as well as the increased rigidity?  :wink:  But seriously definitely looks the part  :happy2:

4ndy

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #8 on: July 14, 2017, 10:52:25 pm »
So 460 quidies for a couple of mop sticks and some ikea brackets?

Only kidding mate, good work

 :grin:  That's pretty much the sum of it  :happy2:
Id need to drive around with the hatch open to get my moneys worth

Offline rich83

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #9 on: July 15, 2017, 11:00:25 am »
I just don't know what to say...... or where to begin........

In summary....

1) That's a rip off of monumental proportion.
2) It will not make that much difference.

Sorry Pudding.... The upshot though is that it looks very well made  :happy2:
« Last Edit: July 15, 2017, 11:03:51 am by rich83 »

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #10 on: July 16, 2017, 11:23:02 am »
No drilling, say what?? There must be a catch, surely?

Mmmmmmmm....nice bling but...

Catch: Yes, the rear seat securing catch bales appear to be what is providing the "added stiffness" for the diagonal. It will interesting to see if these relatively flimsy attachments distort when loaded in this plane. The video instructions seem to stress not to overtighten during installation I suspect, because you will be able to tear the catch bales off the shell fairly easily?
 Similar for the appx 5mm captive bolts on the cargo net attachments. But perhaps less likely to bend/pull out as probably less tension in this bar?
In short. Attachments to shell don't seem meaty enough to me?

Excellent write up tho buddy...let us know how it goes.

Remain to be convinced!

Offline pudding

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #11 on: July 17, 2017, 09:08:54 am »
Good review buddy.

Probably not substantial enough to mount harnesses around, would you say?

@Tfsi_Mike They also do a 'no drilling' harness bar  :smiley:  The guys at Tyrolsport have said they can offer discounts to UK customers, which is jolly decent of them  :smiley:


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Offline pudding

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #12 on: July 17, 2017, 09:27:56 am »
I just don't know what to say...... or where to begin........

In summary....

1) That's a rip off of monumental proportion.
2) It will not make that much difference.

Sorry Pudding.... The upshot though is that it looks very well made  :happy2:

2 of these kits wouldn't even buy me a Mulberry handbag  :smiley:  Everything is relative.   I wouldn't say it's a rip off any more than TTE charging £2.5K for a wholesale KO4 Borg Wiener with bigger wheels in it, or AP Racing charging £2.5K for some chunks of steel and alloy.  And what difference do they make relative to a car that's fast and handles well out of the box, once you add up what it costs to build a 400hp TFSI?

This is what hobbys and interests are all about......cost is secondary.  If cost is the primary concern, then perhaps a different/cheaper hobby should be considered, such as chess or cross stitch  :smiley:


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Offline pudding

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #13 on: July 17, 2017, 09:33:20 am »
No drilling, say what?? There must be a catch, surely?

Mmmmmmmm....nice bling but...

Catch: Yes, the rear seat securing catch bales appear to be what is providing the "added stiffness" for the diagonal. It will interesting to see if these relatively flimsy attachments distort when loaded in this plane. The video instructions seem to stress not to overtighten during installation I suspect, because you will be able to tear the catch bales off the shell fairly easily?
 Similar for the appx 5mm captive bolts on the cargo net attachments. But perhaps less likely to bend/pull out as probably less tension in this bar?
In short. Attachments to shell don't seem meaty enough to me?

Excellent write up tho buddy...let us know how it goes.

Remain to be convinced!

I'm not sure I follow what you mean, but everything feels pretty substantial to me  :happy2:


2007 ED30 | 2009 TDI 140 | 2016 BMW 330D

willni

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Re: TyrolSport rear turret brace (Stage 2 version)
« Reply #14 on: July 17, 2017, 09:49:22 am »
No drilling, say what?? There must be a catch, surely?

Mmmmmmmm....nice bling but...

Catch: Yes, the rear seat securing catch bales appear to be what is providing the "added stiffness" for the diagonal. It will interesting to see if these relatively flimsy attachments distort when loaded in this plane. The video instructions seem to stress not to overtighten during installation I suspect, because you will be able to tear the catch bales off the shell fairly easily?
 Similar for the appx 5mm captive bolts on the cargo net attachments. But perhaps less likely to bend/pull out as probably less tension in this bar?
In short. Attachments to shell don't seem meaty enough to me?

Excellent write up tho buddy...let us know how it goes.

Remain to be convinced!

I'm not sure I follow what you mean, but everything feels pretty substantial to me  :happy2:


At the end of the day it's cheaper than smoking or drinking. Structurally speaking it would work, it's no different essentially than a engine strut brace, true not fitted as securely as the top mount bolts but then there's no real weight being transferred in the back of the car and the seat catches will be reinforced with the actual seats.