All Things Mk5 > Performance Modifications
Clutch slipping... Helix still the one to get?
AJP:
--- Quote from: Pudding on February 23, 2016, 12:39:40 pm ---
--- Quote from: AJP on February 20, 2016, 06:05:52 pm ---
--- Quote from: BradCobbs on February 20, 2016, 01:24:29 pm ---I've had the same problem in the last couple weeks which is gradually getting worse.
With 130,000 miles on the clock I think it has done well.
Will an OE clutch simply not take the extra torque that stage 1 provides? I've done roughly 8,000 miles since the remap.
Obviously an uprated clutch is the way to go, but they are significantly more expensive.
--- End quote ---
From what I gather, an oem clutch should handle stage 1 levels of torque, but simply won't last anywhere near as long as it should.
I suppose it depends how long you plan to keep the car, and if further power mods are a possibility down the line. For me, I'll be keeping the GTI for a good 5+ more years and I am planning more power, so it wouldn't make sense to go for another oem clutch in my situation.
Also if you look at the job as a whole, done right with a new flywheel, plus labour, it's a dear job whichever way you look at it. The clutch itself is just one part of the job so you're not going to be saving a huge amount relatively.
I like the idea of having a clutch that you can put 400lb/ft through. Not sure the con rods will be too happy but that's just another a bridge to be crossed when it arises..
--- End quote ---
A brand new OEM clutch can cope with 300lbft, just. One that's beyond half worn, doesn't like it and has been demonstrated enough times now that it's almost a fact!
Also, bear in mind VW only rate their FWD turbo gearboxes to a maximum of 280lbft, so over-boosting our cars puts us all on borrowed time anyway....but I digress....
.....Just to add some context to this because forums tend to be black or white with these things..... I am talking about peak boost / torque when the car is over-geared (so 6th on the motorway), peak boost up a hill in 4th and sometimes 3rd. Most of the time on a flat or slight down hill and with the wind behind you, the clutch can cope with it. Throw a cold winter's day into the mix and the variables all change again!
Just prior to getting my clutch done and with Revo, it was spinning up 3rd like clockwork, in the dry. After it was custom mapped, it was barely wheel spinning at all and just didn't feel as responsive when in boost. Why? Because the damn clutch was slipping!!! Threw the helix in and it's 'f'ck me', what an animal!!!
--- End quote ---
Can safely say I agree with this!
BradCobbs:
--- Quote from: Pudding on February 23, 2016, 12:39:40 pm ---
A brand new OEM clutch can cope with 300lbft, just. One that's beyond half worn, doesn't like it and has been demonstrated enough times now that it's almost a fact!
Also, bear in mind VW only rate their FWD turbo gearboxes to a maximum of 280lbft, so over-boosting our cars puts us all on borrowed time anyway....but I digress....
.....Just to add some context to this because forums tend to be black or white with these things..... I am talking about peak boost / torque when the car is over-geared (so 6th on the motorway), peak boost up a hill in 4th and sometimes 3rd. Most of the time on a flat or slight down hill and with the wind behind you, the clutch can cope with it. Throw a cold winter's day into the mix and the variables all change again!
Just prior to getting my clutch done and with Revo, it was spinning up 3rd like clockwork, in the dry. After it was custom mapped, it was barely wheel spinning at all and just didn't feel as responsive when in boost. Why? Because the damn clutch was slipping!!! Threw the helix in and it's 'f'ck me', what an animal!!!
--- End quote ---
So in regards to the flywheel replacement, has anyone actually had any problems with them?
I've only ever encountered issues with Diesel Dual Mass Flywheels as the vibrations from compression strokes are far greater than those of a petrol.
I'm a mechanic so I'll be doing the work myself and think I'm gonna chance mine and just go with the clutch. I'm sure that'll come around to bite me in the arse, it's inevitable.
AJP:
--- Quote from: BradCobbs on February 23, 2016, 05:38:44 pm ---
--- Quote from: Pudding on February 23, 2016, 12:39:40 pm ---
A brand new OEM clutch can cope with 300lbft, just. One that's beyond half worn, doesn't like it and has been demonstrated enough times now that it's almost a fact!
Also, bear in mind VW only rate their FWD turbo gearboxes to a maximum of 280lbft, so over-boosting our cars puts us all on borrowed time anyway....but I digress....
.....Just to add some context to this because forums tend to be black or white with these things..... I am talking about peak boost / torque when the car is over-geared (so 6th on the motorway), peak boost up a hill in 4th and sometimes 3rd. Most of the time on a flat or slight down hill and with the wind behind you, the clutch can cope with it. Throw a cold winter's day into the mix and the variables all change again!
Just prior to getting my clutch done and with Revo, it was spinning up 3rd like clockwork, in the dry. After it was custom mapped, it was barely wheel spinning at all and just didn't feel as responsive when in boost. Why? Because the damn clutch was slipping!!! Threw the helix in and it's 'f'ck me', what an animal!!!
--- End quote ---
So in regards to the flywheel replacement, has anyone actually had any problems with them?
I've only ever encountered issues with Diesel Dual Mass Flywheels as the vibrations from compression strokes are far greater than those of a petrol.
I'm a mechanic so I'll be doing the work myself and think I'm gonna chance mine and just go with the clutch. I'm sure that'll come around to bite me in the arse, it's inevitable.
--- End quote ---
I think the point is that if you're in there doing the clutch it's pointless to leave in a flywheel that's got maybe 6 months on it.
By all accounts an oem dmf works well with the Helix.
pudding:
Tbh, if the original DMF isn't rattling, I'd be tempted to leave it. I replaced mine as a matter of course but I noticed a brand new one is just as loose and sloppy as a 75K old one. Complete pieces of sh1t those things are.
You must specify to Helix whether your DMF is LUK or SACHS at the time of order though. I've used both brands and they're as bad as each other, so take your pick!
AJP:
Well I've messaged @vRSAlex so I'll pick his brains and see what the best option is.
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