All Things Mk5 > Performance Modifications

Shall I jump on the slope?

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Dan_FR:
An intake doesn't shift the torque band at all. Turbo spool up 'can' be delayed ever so slightly but easily rectified when mapping. Yes they are loud and make lots of wooshy noises all of the time, but they free up hp at the upper end of the rev range without a doubt. If you like (or can live with) the wooshy noises then get one

If sticking with Stage 1 then the cats are the limiting factor so you won't gain too much with one. If you go stage 2 and get a decat turboback exhaust, then the intake will be the next limitation (in terms of peak hp) so it is definitely worth changing. The fuelling is the limitation of midrange torque, and once you've done the exhaust and intake, the turbo becomes the next limitation for peak hp.

If doing trackdays then an intercooler is 100% advised. S3 is adequate or any bolt-on direct replacement (China coolers sub £200) will do nicely. Brakes are 100% needed, they will start to fade within a few laps of track work and will quickly ruin your day as massive brake fade on track is not fun  :driver:

And finally..... When remapping a 100k+ car, expect to need a new clutch very shortly unless it's been changed. If not it is probably worth doing before mapping as if it slips on the dyno yo will end up with reduced torque to work around the clutch

pudding:
You can't 'map out' a fundamental change in induction tuning.

Has anyone got a torque plot below 2500rpm where an aftermarket intake system matches or *betters* the OEM intake? 

I've read some posts on here from guys who've tried all of the intakes on the market and ended up going back to the OEM air box.

Dan_FR:
Actually you can change the dynamics of the engine through cam timing changes etc. to the point where the difference is negligible

So how would a graph provide a fair comparison? If you only care about sub 2500rpm then why not buy a diesel or a naturally aspirated engine!? Why not a comparison of the full rpm range to show where there are losses and where there are gains in order to judge whether it is 'worth having'........ and would it be back to back or with mapping changes to take full advantage?

If intakes were a waste of money then why does everybody fit one? Anyone got a high power K03 or K04 on the standard airbox?

People seem to forget that there is always a trade off when modifying or changing parts. Removing a restrictive narrow intake will cause the air flow to slow which will hinder low end performance slightly (i.e. off boost driving), but provide gains when 'on boost' which should outweigh any negatives. I have a very free flowing intake and I have absolutely no noticeable loss of off boost performance, and the turbo is almost always there, spooling up and aiding performance, full boost is achieved well below 3k rpm...... so I'm yet to see a drawback... but then my MAF scaling is near perfect, idle trims within 1% and multiplicative hovering between -1 and -5% (due to meth - disable this and its within 2 or 3%)

That's the other thing people are always forgetting is MAF scaling and the difference it makes when swapping out to an intake without having the MAF scaling adjusted to suit. When I ran the RamAir MAF pipe on mine the car felt lethargic and registered peak MAF readings 30g/s lower than my current intake

Just winds me up when people slate or discourage others from using intakes when there are gains to be had, because somebody somewhere had a bad experience with one, or expects the car to respond just as well and there be no trade-off at all.... .If there was no trade-off then the manufacturers would fit a much more free-flowing induction system from factory..... but they don't..... Their priority is efficiency, fuel economy, minimum NVH etc. etc... not ultimate peak performance under WOT

AJP:
I'm sure there's a thread for the intake debate guys, as much as you both make valid points.

Focusing on a full exhaust as the main outlay is probably the best plan @driver rider.

A full Powervalve will not be cheap, but I'd be willing to bet they flow better than any other exhaust on the market for our GTIs.

By far the biggest restriction on the TFSI is the puny downpipe. Which in itself houses the main cat and pre cat. All bad for flow, and bad for exhaust gas temperatures. This is largely why a typical Stage 1 map will only be programmed to push the boost so far. Opening up that restriction allows more leeway in the mapping, and therefore more power and torque is achieved.

In my case, I did things in the wrong order. I went to R-Tech for a Stage 1, and enjoyed that thoroughly for a while. Then I spoke to Nige and he agreed to run another group buy on his Powervalve exhausts. I had mine fitted a few months ago - full Powervalve with 200 cell sport cat. I'm down at R-Tech soon to have the map tweaked to account for the exhaust. This will effectively put my at Stage 2, or thereabouts.

I can honestly say the exhaust is phenomenal. Quality, fit, performance, noise and service from Nige and the team is right up there.

The fuel pump upgrade sounds  much more beneficial than an intake, to me. I'm looking at things from a 'what's next?' perspective, and from everything I've researched the fuel pump will give gains across the revs, whereas an intake is more of a top end boost. It's not a massive job to change pumps, it's all under the bonnet. The cam follower wears faster with an uprated pump, so that needs a bit more attention than usual, and you're likely to be stressing your standard clutch (if manual) with the extra levels of torque an uprated pump provides. The Helix Organic is a good choice. I've got one. Rated to 400lb/ft and feels really good.

You can go on forever, spend thousands, for diminishing returns. And it's hard to stop...!

AJP:
Oh and it's an important point that flashp makes about brakes. If you're tracking it, arguably it would be wise to uprate the brakes before you even touch the engine.

The standard brakes overheat really easily. I managed to cook mine after about 20 minutes over the Welsh mountains a while ago. Massive fade. Scary.

S3/R32 fronts are the most basic upgrade. The calipers are heavy though, as are the 345mm discs, although I think you can use the slightly lighter 340mm Audi TTS discs with those calipers without the need for an adaptor bracket.

Then there's the 4 piston TTRS caliper. I'll be going for these along with TTS discs and adaptors. The piston area on these isn't out of comfortable tolerance for the GTI master cylinder, unlike some larger 6 piston calipers that seem popular.

Plenty of threads to research on brakes.

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