Post by: UniquEd30 on December 08, 2016, 04:22:15 pm
I've got a Manual Reflex silver Ed. 30 2008. Recently have noticed loss of power and after about 5/10mins driving, the revs go up to around 2k at most. Sometimes it sticks, sometimes it drops. Regardless, it how happens everytime I drive it. Also noticed that the biting point is harder to catch now. What I mean by this is it feels like I have to apply more gas otherwise the car will start jerking. And recently since I've noticed the problems my start ups has been really rusty, crap shoddy type of start. And been told the car smokes quite a bit of thick grey smoke.
Here's a video to my idle problem;
Any ideas what the problem is here? Needing help through here before heading to a garage.
Much appreciated.
Post by: AJP on December 08, 2016, 07:01:15 pm
The PCV should really be checked and if necessary replaced along with a service; even though VW don't deem it a serviceable item, they often fail. You can list the diverter valve and cam follower in that category too.
First off, with the engine idling pull the oil dipstick. If the engine doesn't change in the way it's idling it's a fair indication that the PCV has seen better days. Usually with a good PCV, pulling the dipstick will cause the engine to idle badly. Put the dipstick back in, and a good idle is restored.
If that fails, I'd get it scanned. Any fault codes might give you a starting point. But be mindful that the lack of a code doesn't necessarily indicate the lack of a fault. One step better than a code scan is live data logging with VCDS. If you're paying a garage to do the diagnostics with VCDS the cost will soon start adding up. It'd help if you knew a friend or fellow forum member with VCDS!
Post by: AJP on December 08, 2016, 08:58:23 pm
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 08, 2016, 10:29:39 pm
Oh and let us know how you get on please. Don't be one of those guys that signs up to get an answer to a question and then dissappears.
Cheers pal, so much information to work with. I'll keep this topic posted.
I'm new to VW, where can I locate this PCV? & Diverter Valve?
And also when you say idle badly, I should expect the revs to go up and down? Or...
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 09, 2016, 10:00:07 am
Post by: pudding on December 09, 2016, 10:22:46 am
OK, your first jobs then:
PCV update - http://www.psituning.com/product.php/21395/oem_pcv_breather_update_kit___2_0tfsi
Cam follower - http://www.psituning.com/product.php/23731/cam_follower_replacement_kit___2_0_tfsi
Boost recirculation valve (aka 'DV', or 'dump valve') - http://www.psituning.com/product.php/22466/gfb_dv__diverter_valve_kit___2_0_tfsi_2_0tsi
You don't have to buy those items from that company, I just posted them for convenience and pictures of what you need. I think their pricing is comparable to other places though.
The PCV parts are under the engine cover. The front one is screwed to the cam cover and 5 mins to replace. The rear one is more work and very fiddly, but DIYable.
The cam follower is under the mechanical fuel pump. Again DIYable and plenty of info on it on this site.
The DV is in front of the radiator and very easy to change.
These parts should solve your issue and cover the common failings that need addressing.
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 09, 2016, 06:41:51 pm
Welcome to ED30 ownership :happy2:
OK, your first jobs then:
PCV update - http://www.psituning.com/product.php/21395/oem_pcv_breather_update_kit___2_0tfsi
Cam follower - http://www.psituning.com/product.php/23731/cam_follower_replacement_kit___2_0_tfsi
Boost recirculation valve (aka 'DV', or 'dump valve') - http://www.psituning.com/product.php/22466/gfb_dv__diverter_valve_kit___2_0_tfsi_2_0tsi
You don't have to buy those items from that company, I just posted them for convenience and pictures of what you need. I think their pricing is comparable to other places though.
The PCV parts are under the engine cover. The front one is screwed to the cam cover and 5 mins to replace. The rear one is more work and very fiddly, but DIYable.
The cam follower is under the mechanical fuel pump. Again DIYable and plenty of info on it on this site.
The DV is in front of the radiator and very easy to change.
These parts should solve your issue and cover the common failings that need addressing.
Thank you, very helpful.
So just an update, I went out and did the dipstick test, as the engine was running I pulled the dipstick out, pressure was released and the engine started shaking a lot and sounded like engine was going to cut out but didn't. So i'm assuming that the PCV is okay?
How will I know that the Cam, DV needs replacing from looking at them once I locate them?
Car was serviced at 126027 at VW. And its currently reading 130498. Motorway miles.
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 10, 2016, 09:07:01 am
So I've noticed that the revs idles worst after accelerating or putting my foot down a bit aggressively..
I will be heading over to a friends house this afternoon as he has a Fault code reader.
I think I'm losing miles too..
Post by: AJP on December 10, 2016, 11:36:00 am
Right..Remember to check under 'pending' codes as well as stored faults.
So I've noticed that the revs idles worst after accelerating or putting my foot down a bit aggressively..
I will be heading over to a friends house this afternoon as he has a Fault code reader.
I think I'm losing miles too..
You might find you get more info with VAG-specific diagnostics (VCDS) but it's a start. Fingers crossed it sheds some light.
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 10, 2016, 05:15:59 pm
No faults found. No faukts stored or pending.
I noticed my Mass Air Flow (MAF) readings was bouncing between 2.0 and 4.0 as my revs was going up and down.
The Turbo bar was changed most recently by VW as it made a hissing sound, I'be heard a hissing sound every now and again, could it be this? Maybe come loose or faulty?
Post by: mrw on December 11, 2016, 06:25:47 pm
I did the dipstick test and it passed, once it started to whistle (confirming the issue) I replaced the PCV valve. I paid £29.99+VAT (minus the gasket etc) from TPS (https://tps.trade/ - I don't believe all of them will sell to the public) back in July so not a great expense if you wish to take a chance.
The chap at TPS who served me mentioned they do have a lot of problems with one of the pipes that sit at the back of the engine that connects to the PCV, I think its the metal one that is shown on 'PCV update' posted by pudding. He said the latter cars have a revised pipe (mine was one) which aren't so problematic.
Do you have a part number of what VW changed?
Post by: AJP on December 11, 2016, 07:38:17 pm
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 11, 2016, 11:53:59 pm
UniquEd30, that video reminds of the problems I had ('08 regular GTI), before my PCV failed. Mine did start to climb to 2k revs and with a blip of the throttle the rev's returned to normal before waiting a couple of seconds and started to climb again. Vag Com showed nothing!
I did the dipstick test and it passed, once it started to whistle (confirming the issue) I replaced the PCV valve. I paid £29.99+VAT (minus the gasket etc) from TPS (https://tps.trade/ - I don't believe all of them will sell to the public) back in July so not a great expense if you wish to take a chance.
The chap at TPS who served me mentioned they do have a lot of problems with one of the pipes that sit at the back of the engine that connects to the PCV, I think its the metal one that is shown on 'PCV update' posted by pudding. He said the latter cars have a revised pipe (mine was one) which aren't so problematic.
Do you have a part number of what VW changed?
Just been through the service book receipts and I can confirm a Turbo boost hose was supplied and fitted by Beadles VW Maidstone. I am assuming this is the parts number: V1K0 145 832 P. This was changed on 27/07/16.
Today I have noticed a short hissing(possibly a whistle) type of noise coming from outside the window for a period of 2-4seconds. Usually after putting my foot down a little.
So you're saying my PCV could possibly be on its way out even though no fault codes came up as well as passing the dipstick test?
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 11, 2016, 11:55:08 pm
Just for info, if you do replace the PCV I believe the revision R is the one to get.
Any links to where I can purchase one? And also it will be a direct fit? Whats the benefits of the revision R PCV?
Post by: AJP on December 11, 2016, 11:59:32 pm
It's a VW part, so from a dealer or TPS. The benefit is that the design has been revised over time. Just like the diverter valve revisions, earlier iterations of the same function were improved upon.Just for info, if you do replace the PCV I believe the revision R is the one to get.
Any links to where I can purchase one? And also it will be a direct fit? Whats the benefits of the revision R PCV?
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 12, 2016, 12:16:08 am
It's a VW part, so from a dealer or TPS. The benefit is that the design has been revised over time. Just like the diverter valve revisions, earlier iterations of the same function were improved upon.Just for info, if you do replace the PCV I believe the revision R is the one to get.
Any links to where I can purchase one? And also it will be a direct fit? Whats the benefits of the revision R PCV?
Is it a good idea to purchase a BSH PCV? Would installing this cause my car dash board to come up with a warning/error code?
Post by: AJP on December 12, 2016, 12:27:22 am
I've never had first hand experience of an aftermarket PCV/PCV delete, but I've read several times that the only true delete kit is the one R-Tech sell.It's a VW part, so from a dealer or TPS. The benefit is that the design has been revised over time. Just like the diverter valve revisions, earlier iterations of the same function were improved upon.Just for info, if you do replace the PCV I believe the revision R is the one to get.
Any links to where I can purchase one? And also it will be a direct fit? Whats the benefits of the revision R PCV?
Is it a good idea to purchase a BSH PCV? Would installing this cause my car dash board to come up with a warning/error code?
I had a new VW rev R PCV fitted last summer and it's been working perfectly since. I'd be inclined to suggest you stick to OEM parts.
You might save a lot of guesswork by getting it looked at properly by a good VW specialist, and then decide what you do or don't need to replace.
Post by: pudding on December 12, 2016, 11:45:21 am
UniquEd30, that video reminds of the problems I had ('08 regular GTI), before my PCV failed. Mine did start to climb to 2k revs and with a blip of the throttle the rev's returned to normal before waiting a couple of seconds and started to climb again. Vag Com showed nothing!
I did the dipstick test and it passed, once it started to whistle (confirming the issue) I replaced the PCV valve. I paid £29.99+VAT (minus the gasket etc) from TPS (https://tps.trade/ - I don't believe all of them will sell to the public) back in July so not a great expense if you wish to take a chance.
The chap at TPS who served me mentioned they do have a lot of problems with one of the pipes that sit at the back of the engine that connects to the PCV, I think its the metal one that is shown on 'PCV update' posted by pudding. He said the latter cars have a revised pipe (mine was one) which aren't so problematic.
Do you have a part number of what VW changed?
Just been through the service book receipts and I can confirm a Turbo boost hose was supplied and fitted by Beadles VW Maidstone. I am assuming this is the parts number: V1K0 145 832 P. This was changed on 27/07/16.
Today I have noticed a short hissing(possibly a whistle) type of noise coming from outside the window for a period of 2-4seconds. Usually after putting my foot down a little.
So you're saying my PCV could possibly be on its way out even though no fault codes came up as well as passing the dipstick test?
That hose connects the intercooler to the turbo discharge pipe, so it's not part of the PCV plumbing. Do you get the noise in boost, or when you back off the throttle?
Everyone has a different approach to a new car, but me personally, I replace everything whether it's needed or not, so I can start again from a clean slate.
Within a week of buying my ED30, I replaced all of the above items I listed, along with fresh oil + filter, spark plugs, MAF, coils, air filter, the lot!
I take it to VW to get the rubber service stamps (otherwise you get too many daft questions and low ball offers come resale), but I do the oil and filter every 5K anyway.
It's been a VERY reliable car from keeping on top of the maintenance :happy2:
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 12, 2016, 12:21:24 pm
It's a VW part, so from a dealer or TPS. The benefit is that the design has been revised over time. Just like the diverter valve revisions, earlier iterations of the same function were improved upon.Just for info, if you do replace the PCV I believe the revision R is the one to get.
Any links to where I can purchase one? And also it will be a direct fit? Whats the benefits of the revision R PCV?
Any chance of th parts number for the revised R PCV?
Post by: AJP on December 12, 2016, 12:31:25 pm
06F129101RIt's a VW part, so from a dealer or TPS. The benefit is that the design has been revised over time. Just like the diverter valve revisions, earlier iterations of the same function were improved upon.Just for info, if you do replace the PCV I believe the revision R is the one to get.
Any links to where I can purchase one? And also it will be a direct fit? Whats the benefits of the revision R PCV?
Any chance of th parts number for the revised R PCV?
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 12, 2016, 01:52:20 pm
UniquEd30, that video reminds of the problems I had ('08 regular GTI), before my PCV failed. Mine did start to climb to 2k revs and with a blip of the throttle the rev's returned to normal before waiting a couple of seconds and started to climb again. Vag Com showed nothing!
I did the dipstick test and it passed, once it started to whistle (confirming the issue) I replaced the PCV valve. I paid £29.99+VAT (minus the gasket etc) from TPS (https://tps.trade/ - I don't believe all of them will sell to the public) back in July so not a great expense if you wish to take a chance.
The chap at TPS who served me mentioned they do have a lot of problems with one of the pipes that sit at the back of the engine that connects to the PCV, I think its the metal one that is shown on 'PCV update' posted by pudding. He said the latter cars have a revised pipe (mine was one) which aren't so problematic.
Do you have a part number of what VW changed?
Just been through the service book receipts and I can confirm a Turbo boost hose was supplied and fitted by Beadles VW Maidstone. I am assuming this is the parts number: V1K0 145 832 P. This was changed on 27/07/16.
Today I have noticed a short hissing(possibly a whistle) type of noise coming from outside the window for a period of 2-4seconds. Usually after putting my foot down a little.
So you're saying my PCV could possibly be on its way out even though no fault codes came up as well as passing the dipstick test?
That hose connects the intercooler to the turbo discharge pipe, so it's not part of the PCV plumbing. Do you get the noise in boost, or when you back off the throttle?
Everyone has a different approach to a new car, but me personally, I replace everything whether it's needed or not, so I can start again from a clean slate.
Within a week of buying my ED30, I replaced all of the above items I listed, along with fresh oil + filter, spark plugs, MAF, coils, air filter, the lot!
I take it to VW to get the rubber service stamps (otherwise you get too many daft questions and low ball offers come resale), but I do the oil and filter every 5K anyway.
It's been a VERY reliable car from keeping on top of the maintenance :happy2:
The noise when I back off the throttle.
I probably will service it soon just for peace of mind, but for now just need to fogure out whats causing my car these problems.
I'm losing miles too, its drinking.
As for that hose, I was told that there was a hole in it previously thats what caused the hissing sound. Therefore VW replaced it. Could this or components within this area be causing my car problems?
Prob will get it looked at before replacing anything but incline to changing the pcv.
Just for information, car has done 130k and was last serviced at 126k, reckon the battery needs changing? Probably right...
Post by: AJP on December 12, 2016, 04:11:07 pm
I've been doing a bit of digging to confirm that the part number I gave you is correct. It seems you'll need one of two revisions, depending on the part number on your existing PCV - either the revision R or the revision P. Details and part numbers in this Vortex post:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?7649049-2-0t-FSI-PCV-Valve-Replacement-06F129101P-06F129101R
Hope this helps bud.
Post by: mrw on December 12, 2016, 06:14:35 pm
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 12, 2016, 10:00:16 pm
@UniquEd30
I've been doing a bit of digging to confirm that the part number I gave you is correct. It seems you'll need one of two revisions, depending on the part number on your existing PCV - either the revision R or the revision P. Details and part numbers in this Vortex post:
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?7649049-2-0t-FSI-PCV-Valve-Replacement-06F129101P-06F129101R
Hope this helps bud.
Thanks pal, you and a few others in here have been a great help.
Will need to order and get it installed. I hope its the PCV and nothing else making jt an easy fix.
Post by: AJP on December 12, 2016, 10:10:47 pm
Post by: pudding on December 13, 2016, 09:46:19 am
I did the front only on mine (revision P at the time) initially and the revs bounced up and down at idle. Fitted the newer rear pipe and it sorted it. Mine's an 07 plate.
@UniqueED30 - I would have a look at the dump valve. It might be split. You would only get leaks from the new boost pipe if they didn't fit it properly. It comes with new O rings, so I doubt they are worn out, but look for a puddle of oil on the belly tray at the pipe connections. If you see that, boosted air is escaping.
Post by: f00glee on December 13, 2016, 08:00:15 pm
If you update the front PCV valve, you need to make sure the rear one (the metal corrugated pipe that goes from the cam cover to the turbo) is also the updated one with the check valve in it.
I did the front only on mine (revision P at the time) initially and the revs bounced up and down at idle. Fitted the newer rear pipe and it sorted it. Mine's an 07 plate.
@UniqueED30 - I would have a look at the dump valve. It might be split. You would only get leaks from the new boost pipe if they didn't fit it properly. It comes with new O rings, so I doubt they are worn out, but look for a puddle of oil on the belly tray at the pipe connections. If you see that, boosted air is escaping.
just wanted to weigh in on the PCV/check valve quandry... This is what i found a while back, copied from an older post of mine:
"It seems revisions E, G and P require breather pipe with valve. Revisions N, L, K, F, C and R do not.
sources:
http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=44709.0
http://shopdap.com/2-0t-fsi-pcv-valve-failure-how-it-sounds-and-more/
The first link shows how the rev G requires the check valve, the second shows the two "types" of PCV. So reading between the lines I think that suggests which types do/do not require the "valved" breather hose."
I went from N -> R and did not have the breather pipe changed. :happy2:
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 14, 2016, 12:43:18 am
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 14, 2016, 01:29:13 pm
No probs, happy to help. Fingers crossed it sorts it - keep us updated.
So what I've noticed today was driving for a duration of 20mins mainly motorway miles, my temp sat at 70'c, as I arrived to my destination and parked, it went up to just below 90'c. strange right?
Post by: f00glee on December 14, 2016, 04:31:36 pm
No probs, happy to help. Fingers crossed it sorts it - keep us updated.
So what I've noticed today was driving for a duration of 20mins mainly motorway miles, my temp sat at 70'c, as I arrived to my destination and parked, it went up to just below 90'c. strange right?
That sounds like a thermostat stuck open - meaning some coolant is always flowing through the radiator and keeping your temperatures down. Normally the thermostat should keep the coolant around the engine till it reaches temperature, at which point the radiator is bought in to the circuit via thermostat opening.
At least, thats the general idea. Not sure of the intimate details of the MK5 GTI (I understand there are two thermostats).
Post by: AJP on December 14, 2016, 04:32:18 pm
That'll be the thermostat. Afaik there's more than one.No probs, happy to help. Fingers crossed it sorts it - keep us updated.
So what I've noticed today was driving for a duration of 20mins mainly motorway miles, my temp sat at 70'c, as I arrived to my destination and parked, it went up to just below 90'c. strange right?
Post by: AJP on December 14, 2016, 04:32:58 pm
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 14, 2016, 07:21:27 pm
No probs, happy to help. Fingers crossed it sorts it - keep us updated.
So what I've noticed today was driving for a duration of 20mins mainly motorway miles, my temp sat at 70'c, as I arrived to my destination and parked, it went up to just below 90'c. strange right?
That sounds like a thermostat stuck open - meaning some coolant is always flowing through the radiator and keeping your temperatures down. Normally the thermostat should keep the coolant around the engine till it reaches temperature, at which point the radiator is bought in to the circuit via thermostat opening.
At least, thats the general idea. Not sure of the intimate details of the MK5 GTI (I understand there are two thermostats).
Right i'm totally newbie to this, whats the solution or fix?
Post by: AJP on December 14, 2016, 07:28:24 pm
Post by: f00glee on December 14, 2016, 07:46:13 pm
No probs, happy to help. Fingers crossed it sorts it - keep us updated.
So what I've noticed today was driving for a duration of 20mins mainly motorway miles, my temp sat at 70'c, as I arrived to my destination and parked, it went up to just below 90'c. strange right?
That sounds like a thermostat stuck open - meaning some coolant is always flowing through the radiator and keeping your temperatures down. Normally the thermostat should keep the coolant around the engine till it reaches temperature, at which point the radiator is bought in to the circuit via thermostat opening.
At least, thats the general idea. Not sure of the intimate details of the MK5 GTI (I understand there are two thermostats).
Right i'm totally newbie to this, whats the solution or fix?
Don't know enough to be able to advise you other than research the thermostats and see if you can diagnose yourself. Otherwise get a garage to look!
Post by: pudding on December 15, 2016, 12:26:09 pm
If you update the front PCV valve, you need to make sure the rear one (the metal corrugated pipe that goes from the cam cover to the turbo) is also the updated one with the check valve in it.
I did the front only on mine (revision P at the time) initially and the revs bounced up and down at idle. Fitted the newer rear pipe and it sorted it. Mine's an 07 plate.
@UniqueED30 - I would have a look at the dump valve. It might be split. You would only get leaks from the new boost pipe if they didn't fit it properly. It comes with new O rings, so I doubt they are worn out, but look for a puddle of oil on the belly tray at the pipe connections. If you see that, boosted air is escaping.
just wanted to weigh in on the PCV/check valve quandry... This is what i found a while back, copied from an older post of mine:
"It seems revisions E, G and P require breather pipe with valve. Revisions N, L, K, F, C and R do not.
sources:
http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=44709.0
http://shopdap.com/2-0t-fsi-pcv-valve-failure-how-it-sounds-and-more/
The first link shows how the rev G requires the check valve, the second shows the two "types" of PCV. So reading between the lines I think that suggests which types do/do not require the "valved" breather hose."
I went from N -> R and did not have the breather pipe changed. :happy2:
Thanks mate :smiley:
So if I have a P and the revised rear tube, if I fit an R, will that still work or do I need to put the old valve-less tube back on?
Post by: f00glee on December 15, 2016, 06:22:22 pm
If you update the front PCV valve, you need to make sure the rear one (the metal corrugated pipe that goes from the cam cover to the turbo) is also the updated one with the check valve in it.
I did the front only on mine (revision P at the time) initially and the revs bounced up and down at idle. Fitted the newer rear pipe and it sorted it. Mine's an 07 plate.
@UniqueED30 - I would have a look at the dump valve. It might be split. You would only get leaks from the new boost pipe if they didn't fit it properly. It comes with new O rings, so I doubt they are worn out, but look for a puddle of oil on the belly tray at the pipe connections. If you see that, boosted air is escaping.
just wanted to weigh in on the PCV/check valve quandry... This is what i found a while back, copied from an older post of mine:
"It seems revisions E, G and P require breather pipe with valve. Revisions N, L, K, F, C and R do not.
sources:
http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=44709.0
http://shopdap.com/2-0t-fsi-pcv-valve-failure-how-it-sounds-and-more/
The first link shows how the rev G requires the check valve, the second shows the two "types" of PCV. So reading between the lines I think that suggests which types do/do not require the "valved" breather hose."
I went from N -> R and did not have the breather pipe changed. :happy2:
Thanks mate :smiley:
So if I have a P and the revised rear tube, if I fit an R, will that still work or do I need to put the old valve-less tube back on?
I believe if you do that you'll end up with a horrible noise as the extra valve flaps open and closed! Saw some videos where it made a horrible sound like an old generator. Better be safe rather than sorry and stick with PCV/pipe combinations stated above
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Post by: mrw on December 15, 2016, 09:20:13 pm
Post by: GrayMK5GTI on December 15, 2016, 09:30:52 pm
I think all this talk of PCVs is distracting from the real issue - I think an injector has failed and is literally pouring fuel into a cylinder.
Don't drive it hard until it's sorted :happy2:
Oh, and your thermostat is defo failed, I had same symptoms
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 16, 2016, 11:50:04 am
Grey smoke is fuel vapour.
I think all this talk of PCVs is distracting from the real issue - I think an injector has failed and is literally pouring fuel into a cylinder.
Don't drive it hard until it's sorted :happy2:
Oh, and your thermostat is defo failed, I had same symptoms
Hey pal,
Any way I can test if the injectors have failed? Or what I should look for?
Is it DIY-able the thermostat?
Post by: UniquEd30 on December 23, 2016, 01:26:27 pm
MAJOR UPDATE!
So after weeks of confusion, loss of power and miles I have finally fixed my ed30 running as it should with all power restored.
It all came down to an OEM PCV which was on its way out.
So just incase anyone else comes across this, the problems I noticed was;
- Loss in power
- Rusty engine start
- Car smoking a lot usually light grey smoke
- Revs going up and down (between 900/1800)
No engine light whatsoever and no codes found when performing a fault-code test. After some days later of driving around still, engine light came on with code "p0171 system too lean (bank 1)". I replaced my old pcv with a Revision R pcv from TPS. Swiped the engine code clear and the car came out of some sort of restricted safety mode, and the car now runs amazing.
Thanks a lot guys!