MK5 Golf GTI
General => Product Reviews => Topic started by: RedRobin on February 04, 2009, 11:21:30 pm
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WHY:
When I first saw pics of a new Audi with Daylight Running Lights my first thought was how uber-cool they looked. But it wasn't until I was cruising at around 120 mph on a German autobahn and saw them in my rear-view mirror that I then realised also what an excellent safety feature they were. It's good practice and sensible when travelling at high speeds to maximise other road users' awareness of your presence and approach by having lights on. Regardless of the brightness of daylight, headlamps tend to flare and make it more difficult to assess the size of vehicle and therefore its distance, and hence to quickly compute how soon that fast moving vehicle will be on your tail. When you are continually driving at around 120 mph and needing to watch the traffic ahead, you want to achieve a smooth flow which doesn't result in interfering unnecessarily with faster traffic behind which is doing 160-180 mph - Quite common on unrestricted sections of the autobahns. Zap > Zap > Zap....Audi RS6 > Mercedes AMG > Porsche, all at around 180 mph.
As LED Daylight Running Lights, known as DRL's, deliver a passive signal light and not a light which illuminates, they don't strongly flare and consequently they allow you to instantly assess the size, distance, and speed of approach in your rear view mirrors, and so you are far more easily enabled to flow into an appropriate lane without any drama or increased risk to safety.
That's just one added safety benefit. When we move back to boring old British roads which are restricted to 70 (actually they're not all boring at all, but the 70 limit is sometimes when it's clearly safe for the road / conditions / traffic / car), there are plenty of visibility circumstances where a road is intermittently and randomly cast in deep shadow contrasting with bright sunlight on a two-way road. An oncoming vehicle is often invisible as it passes through the deeply shadowed areas, but is clearly visible if it has DRL's. By the same token, you can be better seen if you have DRL's and potential head-on incidents reduced. So, DRL's have more than an autobahn-only advantage.
I also became aware that after a certain date (2010?) all new cars will be obliged by law to be DRL equipped. In the UK, this has resulted in a certain amount of debate and resistance (surprise! surprise!).
SOURCING:
As soon as I had experienced their use in Europe, I decided I was going to get some on my Mk5 GTI. Initial research found that they were difficult to get unless you spent upwards of £30,000 for the rest of the Audi. Audi seem to have a monopoly on their pretty rows of LED's. The TTshop helped me out in sourcing some Audi strips but their fitment would have involved cutting into the crash fender and there was no way I was willing to do that, although someone in America has done so.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2FDRL_GTI.jpg&hash=42e226161056cb1bc2c87db1874490aed335145e)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.tyresmoke.net%2Fattachments%2F1307467-DRL_upper.jpg&hash=9dc1f38230401e70be867813cb6316352eadfbbb)
^ Photoshop mock-up ^
My initial aim was for an Audi-style LED strip style. It would have been possible but would be difficult to make look as if OEM.
I knew that Hella were a major vehicle lights manufacturer and that they had been developing LED solutions, so I contacted Hella UK. However, they didn't know what I was talking about and I had to politely bully them into giving me a more senior contact. He wasn't very helpful either but I made a polite nuisance of myself and persuaded him to give me the email address of someone at Hella in Germany - I think he was glad to be rid of me. Hella in Germany were immediately helpful and understood what I was seeking. They put me in touch with an ex-Hella employee who was a specialist distributor for them and he sent me samples of both strip and round LED DRL units! The strip units were the same as the ones the TTshop had sourced and the round ones were a generic design for the Golf Mk5 and other cars but not the GTI. However, this was only because of a difference in oem fog grills and fixing methods. Their round design is intended for location where foglights usually are.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FMods%2FHellaDRL_boxpic.jpg&hash=4be60f632a57cd37d1d375c178bef500ef3373f7)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2FDRL_Hella.jpg&hash=352eb28e797f0ac15d9ff2c361a9a797fa8d9f3f)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FMods%2FHellaDRL_part.jpg&hash=f4ee7507837389efbb6b698c1b5d5668b0b06336)
Not only were Hella Germany very helpful indeed, but they offered me a substantial discount.
INSTALLATION:
As soon as I knew that this might be practical with the Hella round LED units, I had a meeting with my VW dealer and their affiliated body workshop business and a 'dry run' to see what obstacles we might have to overcome so that workshop time on the actual installation could be more efficient. It soon became clear that we would have to adapt the bracket and couldn't use all the same screw holes that the oem foglights use. They are a very tight fit with the stock honeycombed fog panels but we succeeded. We used stainless steel bolts and nylon washers.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2FDRL_Hella_explore.jpg&hash=59b233c1b02cdc22f13c7b9ea3043b5171a60e09)
We followed Hella's wiring instructions so that the DRL's would automatically switch on with ignition and switch themselves off each time any other light was switched on, including via the Auto Lights feature. Also, in VCDS (VAGOS?) my VW dealer disabled the oem foglights so that their 'no bulb' warnings wouldn't keep appearing.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FMods%2FDRLwiring.jpg&hash=47eb039d0db45ecb414e1322c10c0096cb206da7)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2FRED_frontlightsdetail.jpg&hash=db3b64bb884281fde186b2d27159a086a89d9bb1)
^ If you look closely you can see that the upper part of the black plastic panel bulges very slightly. The light unit itself though is a very snug fit. You can shave the rear rim of the aperture with a dremmel and this will cure any slight bulging.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FCarbonfibre%2FDan_Dremmel.jpg&hash=a96009faeab524ff65ebd5898b60bff740b943b5)
Since first writing this review I have changed my oem foglight panels for carbonfibre ones and after dremmelling the backs they fit extremely well - Appearing as if the whole panel and DRL are designed as one unit.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FCarbonfibre%2FRED_29Mar09.jpg&hash=cb392f10a2f90e21e50ddcdfb72c2a2c56ed85fb)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FCarbonfibre%2FCFfogs3.jpg&hash=05f8148d637cc9c07d6070d9672c6b413a1c819f)
Most of the workshop time was spent on the wiring and sorting out the switching instructions on VAS/VAGCOM. Finding the wiring route was very tricky and also bypassing error codes on the now absent fogs. Job took 4 hours. The standard (Euro legal) wiring is such that the DRL's automatically come on with the ignition and automatically go off whenever any of the other lights are switched on. The DRL's will remain on while you flash your headlights though because that's on a separate circuit.
I'm sure you could wire it up independently with a separate aftermarket switch. Also, I could have wired it up as if they were foglights but I didn't want to always have my rear lights on, or sidelights, when running these Hellas. Also, in case of getting police attention for percieved illegal use of foglights, I wanted to be totally legal. I want to be legal in Europe too, hence I decided to go the standard European legal route - On with ignition permanently until such time that other lights are switched on, either automatically (Auto lights feature) or manually.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2FDRL_On_19June08.jpg&hash=da44815576427d85036425e1368cd990db95cba3)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2FRED_HeadOn.jpg&hash=21953492b30f0e6f2f4c61d60875401a216b2938)
The emitted light is of course entirely different from a foglight, being LED and crystal white. Also the DRL's are not a projected beam like a fog light and are a passive signal light which doesn't glare.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2FHellaDRL_p8.jpg&hash=bac00762845b7bcbd531e52f04524db784b6719e)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2FHellaDRL_p9.jpg&hash=a007c4c2801aee63a61215313b443f846c1c8bbc)
ALTERNATIVE CHOICES:
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2Fheadlightpic002.jpg&hash=dbcf460bf09e1c6cab7f1906a943e3534adf9c07)
^ There is an aftermarket non-Xenon headlamp unit available for the Mk5 Golf which has integrated LED DRL strips but I would not wish to sacrifice having Xenons. I don't know how they are wired and if they are Euro-legal. The European rules about switching are very strict.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fw144%2F118d-Sport%2FDSC00875.jpg&hash=cf16ad9540d5814255ccd87dd0f576e28bb05e19)
^ You could change the 'fog grilles' but there would still be a lot of cutting work etc to fit these Audi S6 LED's.
[That GTI needs lowering!!]
MINUS POINTS:
None for me personally but quite a few people don't grasp the safety advantage and can't think beyond seeing them as foglights which shouldn't be on except in fog. Others think that all LED's are chavvy.
I was apprehensive about losing my fogs. I live in an area where we get thick fog and sea-mists on higher ground, though not for half the year! I purposely assessed what driving in fog would be like by switching off my front fogs and I decided that dipped Xenons were totally adequate and the standard fogs are of very lttle benefit if at all.
PLUS POINTS:
I very much enjoy the fact that whenever I switch on the ignition to go out and drive, the LED DRL's are automatically switched on without me having to think about it. They also switch off with the ignition being switched off.
I enjoy the feeling that I may be more easily seen on the road in a great variety of circumstances. Also, because I am very bike-friendly, I like the fact that they are fitted at lower height and cannot be confused.
I think they look cool but by far the biggest plus is the increased safety from being more easily seen without dazzling everyone.
SUMMARY:
I have currently driven about 12,000 miles with these DRL's and have only once had Police attention when a passing marked car in high street traffic indicated by hand that I should switch off my lights. I just smiled at him and he didn't turn around to stop me.
The units are a standard size 90 mm diameter and that seems to be a fairly universal size.
The European approval is for the lamp and nothing to do with which car they are fitted to. They have to be fixed more than 600 mm apart, above ground 250 mm minimum and 400 mm (IIRC) maximum.
The polycarbonate front glazing carries the EC approval refs embossed and includes the "DRL" letters - This conclusively proves to anyone carrying out a roadside inspection that they are NOT fog lights! I also carry the manual in the car to produce to any authority.
The EC rules include how they should be wired to work - On/Off with ignition etc.
I almost want the police to stop me so I can test what happens!
:happy2: 8) :happy2:
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2FRED_DRLsPortchester.jpg&hash=970917f8ed4f3d146791b2c73f4233adcc9af15d)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FNurburgring2009%2FRRR8_Ring.jpg&hash=54bd6eb381f0db4dab8eb7fc47634e3180aec012)
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as usual RR awesome writeup. :happy2: In terms of cost whats the rough price for the units?
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^^^^
I was afraid someone would ask that! It was 9 months ago and I've forgotten but I could look it up (but not tonight - I'm now feeling sleepy).
:happy2:
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Ahhhh, Robin's little monkeys have their own thread :grin:
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Excellent write up there Robin!
I must admit I drive pretty much 99% of the time with my head lights on as it is waiting the excuse "but I didn't see you" from the lame muppet one day who will pull out on me someday in the future.
Interesting to see the bit about the UK not liking change. :) I wonder what it is about change we complain about so much. :) :)
How come you say your lights have to go off when you switch on your main headlights? I am sure just about every Audi I see still has them lit during the night.
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^^^^
Thanks for the compliment, buddy :happy2:
Human beings generally tend to resist change but there's something more stubborn in the average Englischer! I'm generalising of course.
"The European Union plans to make daytime running lamps mandatory on new cars from 2011, and on trucks and buses one and a half years later, according to a report from a German newspaper. The British government is also supporting the move as a way to help increase road safety.
British road safety minister Jim Fitzpatrick has been quoted as saying “the UK has been successful in arguing against the introduction of mandatory use of dipped headlamps during daylight hours by drivers of existing vehicles. However, from early 2011 all new types of passenger cars and light vans will have to be fitted with dedicated daytime running lamps in accordance with the relevant European directive. By summer 2012, all new vehicles will have to be so fitted.â€Â
The use of daytime running lights can lead to fuel efficiency losses but this is being reduced greatly by the increasing number of cars using LEDs for this function. Still, it’s expected that their use contributes to an increase in fuel consumption of 0.5%-1%.
Around 50% of member nations in the EU already require daytime lights, but the EU eventually wants this type of legislation rolled out in every country."
Source: http://www.motorauthority.com/eu-to-mandate-daytime-running-lights.html
I think it's because my Hella DRL's are the type which either substitute (or go alongside) fogs, or their low position which dictates the automatic-switching rule - European Hedgehog Rights perhaps? We're not allowed to dazzle them at night. I don't know the reason for certain, but it is clearly written.
The Audi DRL's are integrated in the headlamps and may be switchable - I don't know. Also some cars have lights which are called DRL's but actually they aren't because they are stronger than x-number of candellas (or whatever the correct measurement is). You could say that your dipped headlights are DRL's but they aren't - You are just using them as if they were.
I've read that the UK authority are going to allow the use of fogs in non-foggy conditions as a transition while the DRL law is first introduced here - How ridiculous! How many people get stopped for inappropriate use of fogs NOW FFS!? I read numerous studies and info from various EC member countries and organisations on the subject of DRL's.
As with anything to do with European bureaucracy, the rulings are very complex and EC member countries and car manufacturers are constantly arguing about them. Hella are a major force in the automobile lights industry and also being German, they tend to know what they're doing. Pity I can't say the same about Hella UK though!
I sent a pic to Germany attached to an email thanking them for all their help. This was the reply I recieved : -
"Wow, this is great. This pleases me for you that we could help. Your car looks really first-class."
AFAIK mine is the only GTI in the whole of the UK with these Hella DRL's. It doesn't seem to be a mod which people go for! Hurdy has the integrated type but he didn't have Xenons originally.
All I know is that I'm really pleased I did this mod and I believe in it's road safety advantages.
:happy2:
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....
I forgot to add that when my car went for its first MOT, the 'inspector' was going to refuse it because of the DRL's!! I had anticipated this possibility (nothing surprises me!) and read him the riot act via my VW dealer (his boss). He was still arguing so we showed him the documentation I keep in the car - He promptly shutup and passed it!
:evilgrin:
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I've liked the DRLs RR but wasn't a fan because they replaced the fogs. Not that I've ever used the fogs except when making sure all the lights work (before long journeys etc).
I've also thought about adding in DRLs next to the fogs, so no one gets confused about whether they're foglights or not. Will have to look into the headlight DRLs thing.
As for change, as I recall, it was stated that we should leave our headlights on all the time, 24-7 (no mention of DRLs) like the more northern countries such as Norway, Finland, Sweden where it's darker so you need lights on during the day anyway. One of the issues was the futulity of leaving on headlights on a bright and sunny day. Another was that motorcyclists use headlight permanently as a way of helping boost their visibility so they're not missed. Having lights on all the time would therefore reduce the how visible motorcyclists were back to square one!
As for me, I tend to run headlights when it's raining or looks particularly overcast in order to boost my visibility to other drivers.
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^^^^
Some of the tastefully converted/modded cars by Hamann (I think Rob works for them?) fit double side by side but our vent panels are limited what we can do without making it looked hacked or amateur.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2FHamann_BMW.jpg&hash=c8dc4ff99ee73c8c76a0886bec5aa475a01d6ee6)
^ Hella DRLs inner and fogs outer ^ - Same monkey-face units as mine.
Yes, using headlights as 'DRLs' would be counter productive regarding motorcyclists - Hence another reason I prefer mine which are low level and non-glare and non-illuminating LEDs.
Using (dipped) headlights to boost your visibility is obviously a good practice but not as good as LED DRLs imo.
All these countries bogged down in writing legislation have got it wrong by not thinking beyond the headlight unit - They totally miss the fundamentals! Hella and Audi with their pretty strips have both got it right imo. Volvo, surprisingly, haven't.
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Nice pic. That's the kinda look I was thinking about (with the fogs and DRLs side-by-side). Not sure about the rest of it and I don't have the vented fog grilles.
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the 32 front looks the business with S6 DRLs
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg22.imageshack.us%2Fimg22%2F6093%2Fmg0919nl6.th.jpg&hash=522a834ad75fc11376315db7f930109a7bf1e972) (http://img22.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mg0919nl6.jpg)
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the 32 front looks the business with S6 DRLs
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg22.imageshack.us%2Fimg22%2F6093%2Fmg0919nl6.jpg&hash=50cc3140a922ddf9625c626e53bf11efb56b5a4a)
^^^^
It sure does but the amount of work involved ain't for the faint-hearted. There's a long thread somewhere in German.
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Excellent info cheers for that Red. I can understand the frustration behind the fog lamp thing there. I am fed up of what can only be complete idiots driving down dark country lanes with side lamps and fog lights on in the pitch black.
I think in all my cars over the years I have used my very rarely as I find they do pish all. I do wish people would use any form of lights during rain, dark and overcast days and even fog. The amount of people I see with no lights on in these situations and even worse hard driving rain with tons of spray so I think DRL is a very good thing and certainly long overdue.
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I do wish people would use any form of lights during rain, dark and overcast days and even fog.
Same here. In fact, on Monday, when it was snowing, it was dim and overcast, less than half had their lights on! I sometimes override the autolight if I feel the conditions determine it.
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....
The only time I use Autolight is when going into my garage, but it's because I have proper LED DRL's that I don't have to think about it - I simply check that they are working and that the lenses are clean before I drive anywhere.
I've come to the conclusion that many people only switch on their lights when they can't see ahead, and never consider whether others can see them!
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I generally drive with my sidelights on all the time during the day, and switch to full-beams quite early. As a note, Mk6 Golfs/Sciroccos come with their full beams on all the time now by default; the "Auto" mode on the headlight switch just changes turns on the interior lighting now, effectively.
More lights = more visibility = more safe.
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As a note, Mk6 Golfs/Sciroccos come with their full beams on all the time now by default
....Full beams literally, or dipped headlights?
That's bad imo - Proper LED DRL's are much more considerate to other road users (incl bikers!).
Rear lights on by default too? - Again bad as they will diffuse the visibility of brake lights. Duh!!
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As a note, Mk6 Golfs/Sciroccos come with their full beams on all the time now by default
....Full beams literally, or dipped headlights?
That's bad imo - Proper LED DRL's are much more considerate to other road users (incl bikers!).
Rear lights on by default too? - Again bad as they will diffuse the visibility of brake lights. Duh!!
Dipped beams, as Volvo has been doing for a number of years.
Frankly I support using dipped beam over DRLs* (though as people object to full beams DRLs are fine). Rear lights are on by default as well - the intensity of brake light shouldn't be affected by a rear light.
*If I had my way we'd be driving with dipped beam, rear lights, and US-style orange sidemarkers on the front wings and at the extreme rear corners of the vehicle. This is perhaps an engineering-centric viewpoint with little or no regard or recourse for other viewpoints, so I'm maybe not the one to listen to about this :P
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^^^^
You and I are totally agreed for the need for and safety advantages of Daylight Running Lights, we have different opinions about what form they take - 'Volvoesque Headlights vs Audiesque LEDs'.
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Hey RR,
How much did they cost you? Deff interested in a set!!
Cheers
Max
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^^^^
Hey Max,
I'll have to look it up for you in all my paperwork so will post info for you later.
Meanwhile, a mate of mine did this! : -
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi28.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fc214%2FDanR32%2FCars%2FRobinDRLs.jpg&hash=039c04b10d38bf20ccbdd555395abfdb177444ad)
^ Too damned right!! ^
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There is an aftermarket non-Xenon headlamp unit available for the Mk5 Golf which has integrated LED DRL strips but I would not wish to sacrifice having Xenons. I don't know how they are wired and if they are Euro-legal. The European rules about switching are very strict.
I have std lights and seeing as I'm not likely to go down the Xenon route (no matter how much I love them, £££ + time + effort isn't worth it, at least not yet), any idea on where I should be looking for these?
I very much enjoy the fact that whenever I switch on the ignition to go out and drive, the LED DRL's are automatically switched on without me having to think about it. They also switch off with the ignition being switched off.
Can't remember if I've asked you this before, but what happens if you stick the autolights on and it's dim outside? I presume the DRLs then switch off and the headlights come on?
[/quote]
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There is an aftermarket non-Xenon headlamp unit available for the Mk5 Golf which has integrated LED DRL strips but I would not wish to sacrifice having Xenons. I don't know how they are wired and if they are Euro-legal. The European rules about switching are very strict.
I have std lights and seeing as I'm not likely to go down the Xenon route (no matter how much I love them, £££ + time + effort isn't worth it, at least not yet), any idea on where I should be looking for these?
....Hurdy has some - He'll know if you PM him.
I very much enjoy the fact that whenever I switch on the ignition to go out and drive, the LED DRL's are automatically switched on without me having to think about it. They also switch off with the ignition being switched off.
Can't remember if I've asked you this before, but what happens if you stick the autolights on and it's dim outside? I presume the DRLs then switch off and the headlights come on?
....Yes, when you have Autolights on and they activate the headlights, the DRL's automatically switch off.
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can i run both fogs and leds together? i dont mean at the same time.. More.. could it be set up so that i can have front/rear fogs on when needed. Or Just front fogs With normal lights on.. Or just the Led's with the normal lights on...?
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^^^^
Legally you MUST have an operational rear red fog light and that can easily continue to function as it does now.
Technically if you are to follow European rules (very strongly advised if you drive in Europe) your DRL's should be installed so they automatically switch on with ignition and off when switching to any other light. I haven't checked if Audi's do this but I've got a big latest 09 Audi to play with soon.
Fogs are a signal light and DRL's (proper ones, not Volvo dipped headlights) are a passive light. The two are independent in all respects.
The UK authorities have discussed that they may allow fogs to be used for a transition period when DRL's become compulsory on all new cars in 2010(?). As fogs are signal lights and so can obviously dazzle, this makes a mockery of the purpose of DRL's, but why am I not surprised!?
If you find someone to install the S6 DRL's, they should know how to wire and switch it. But will they know the Euro rules? My MOT tester didn't until I told him.
It sounds as if you intend to keep the oem fogs and simply (well, it's not simple unfortunately) add the DRL's independently.
Hurdy has aftermarket headlights which incorporate LED strip DRL's, but you can't install those if you have and want to keep Xenons. It's all in this thread.
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....
Original post updated. :happy2:
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^^^^
Legally you MUST have an operational rear red fog light and that can easily continue to function as it does now.
Technically if you are to follow European rules (very strongly advised if you drive in Europe) your DRL's should be installed so they automatically switch on with ignition and off when switching to any other light. I haven't checked if Audi's do this but I've got a big latest 09 Audi to play with soon.
That is categorically NOT what the EU regs state. DRLs can STILL be used with side lamps, dipped headlamps or main beams - which is exactly how Audi, part of the worlds third largest car manufacturing group have been doing for some time now!
Fogs are a signal light and DRL's (proper ones, not Volvo dipped headlights) are a passive light. The two are independent in all respects.
Front fog lamps are NOT classed as 'signal lights' - ONLY indicators are classed as 'signal lights'!
Secondly, DRLs, be they LEDs or tungsten filament lights (like on Volvos) are NOT classed as different - and are IDENTICAL in their function.!!!!
The UK authorities have discussed that they may allow fogs to be used for a transition period when DRL's become compulsory on all new cars in 2010(?).
Where the heck did that bollox come from? Fog lamps will NEVER be allowed to be used in anything other than fog - end of!
As fogs are signal lights and so can obviously dazzle, this makes a mockery of the purpose of DRL's, but why am I not surprised!?
Fog lamps are NOT signal lamps, and when front fog lamps are correctly aligned - they do NOT dazzle. They actually cause less dazzle than a correctly aligned dipped headlamp - which is exactly why a correctly adjusted fog lamp will perform better in fog compared to normal dipped headlamps.
It is only your very wrong information, or wrong interpretation which is making a mockery of this issue - the laws are crystal clear!
If you find someone to install the S6 DRL's, they should know how to wire and switch it. But will they know the Euro rules? My MOT tester didn't until I told him.
Sorry, Robin, but you have interpreted your so-called 'Euro rules' with a major error! DRLs do NOT have to be switched off when headlamps are switched on! Or do you think you know better than Audi AG?
It sounds as if you intend to keep the oem fogs and simply (well, it's not simple unfortunately) add the DRL's independently.
Hurdy has aftermarket headlights which incorporate LED strip DRL's, but you can't install those if you have and want to keep Xenons. It's all in this thread.
Stealth does NOT have Xenons, so Hurdys lights would be ideal. But for those with Xenons, then just use the Xenon dip as a DRL!
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:popcornsoda:
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:popcornsoda:
I hope that's a wheelie bin size of popcorn! :evilgrin:
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:popcornsoda:
any spare jay :wink:
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...
Wow! Someone's been eating their weetabix today! :grin:
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Don't be shy, pass the popcorn about.................
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Just captured this pic of TT getting ready to reply to robins daylight fogs. (https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Ftomashandmilly%2FDaft_stuff%2FBTLC3a.gif&hash=a3459669db07dd206bde42acee5e9a5c7a2d3d45)
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^^^^
Jeezuz, TT! ! - You and I have already discussed all this on the other forum so why repeat all the tedium here?
As I said on the other forum, I read many many pages of various documents and reports commissioned in different countries. I'm not going to spend time trawling through it all again just to answer you point by point.
:rolleye: Pass the popcorn! :popcornsoda:
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(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F3.bp.blogspot.com%2F_WfshYq-JXDk%2FRs88fBWx7tI%2FAAAAAAAAApQ%2FCZW5LdfxObs%2Fs400%2Fpopcorn.JPG&hash=c13f295b08ec8a7373700f937aff1d80ef34c789)
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^^^ is that Sabeen from the Ring?? :signLOL:
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is this enough TC?
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FOeditpusRex%2FSigs%2FBigPopcorn.jpg&hash=bd5da4843eef0779650719a0bfe336e92a59b3b8)
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^^^^
Sabine's got much nicer boobies than that! Ask Nath :evilgrin:
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^^^^
Sabine's got much nicer boobies than that! Ask Nath :evilgrin:
:innocent:
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Trust Nathan to get his Hands full :congrats:
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datytime running lights on a car that didnt come with them as std is ubber lame
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datytime running lights on a car that didnt come with them as std is ubber lame
....Your logic suggests that any modification might be termed as "uber lame". If you don't like them on my car then ok. I do like them and believe strongly in their advantages irrespective of whether a car originally left the factory with them or not, and that's all that matters.
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(straps back in)
:popcornsoda: :grin:
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(straps back in)
:popcornsoda: :grin:
....Now you've rumbled the real reason I got these :evilgrin: : -
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FTrack%2FSchroth_rearfix.jpg&hash=56c59048fcefe37e20addd7b7d0ad23244503e0e)
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Isn't everyone else getting as bored as I am with the usual divided opinion regarding Robin's DRL's? :indifferent:
He likes them, some other's do, some other's don't. Get over it peeps as he's not gonna change them! And being rude about them just isn't on, so if anyone else fanices a pop I will just remove it! :happy2:
Oh and BTW, I like them! :wink:
As you were! :pomppomp:
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^^^^
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: I must admit I do get a bit bored defending my choice when challenged, but that's partly my fault for feeling the need to defend myself.
It's definitely a 'marmite' mod and when I originally posted this review thread I (naively?) thought that more peeps would like them and that this thread would be helpful to those wanting to do the same. I have found to my surprise that DRL's are a very emotive subject.
I love them on the Golf R. :drinking:
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Is your seat falling apart on the right hand side of the picture??
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FTrack%2FSchroth_rearfix.jpg&hash=56c59048fcefe37e20addd7b7d0ad23244503e0e)
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Any constructive criticism is acceptable but comments like that are completely useless.
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PS. Oh and you already know my thoughts on your
cock fog fog lamps!!!
As long as you love them :smiley:
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Any constructive criticism is acceptable but comments like that are completely useless.
:signLOL: If thats aimed at me, how is it useless?, I am asking a question to RR, that doesn't involve you, so that makes your comment completely useless!!! :mad:
Oh cock!
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Any constructive criticism is acceptable but comments like that are completely useless.
:signLOL: If thats aimed at me, how is it useless?, I am asking a question to RR, that doesn't involve you, so that makes your comment completely useless!!! :mad:
Oh cock!
That wasn't aimed at you. You just happened to post just before I did. It was aimed at whoever said RR's DRLs were "ubber lame".
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^^^^
Let's not let this get into a handbags at dawn kinda thing, guys - Gill didn't express his opinion too nicely but I respect he's entitled to it and I'm not taking it personally.
I agree with you though, stealth - There's more constructive or diplomatic ways of expressing an opinion. But let's move on.
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Is your seat falling apart on the right hand side of the picture??
....Looks like it might be! Thanks for spotting it, Oli - I hadn't! I'll check it out tomorrow and see if my friendly upholsterer can fix it.
Damned Recaro's - I better sell them :evilgrin:
:drinking:
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Any constructive criticism is acceptable but comments like that are completely useless.
:signLOL: If thats aimed at me, how is it useless?, I am asking a question to RR, that doesn't involve you, so that makes your comment completely useless!!! :mad:
Oh cock!
That wasn't aimed at you. You just happened to post just before I did. It was aimed at whoever said RR's DRLs were "ubber lame".
Aoplogies! twas late........
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:popcornsoda:
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lol stired it up here ! think the main reason i dislike them is cos there is a rover 214 in my home town with them and as you can guess they look crap , and from that day on even std fitting day ligfhts just dont do it for me .
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^^^^
Jeezuz, TT! ! - You and I have already discussed all this on the other forum so why repeat all the tedium here?
Huh - so are you saying that only YOU has the right to post bull sh!t on this site, and that I can not reply with factual corrections? That is an extremely arrogant point of view, especially as this is a PUBLIC forum - and is completely SEPARATE to the GolfGTIforum!
As I said on the other forum, I read many many pages of various documents and reports commissioned in different countries. I'm not going to spend time trawling through it all again just to answer you point by point.
And you completely FAILED to back up your point of view. And you also were NOT able to counter any of my comments on the other forum either!!!!!
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Isn't everyone else getting as bored as I am with the usual divided opinion regarding Robin's DRL's? :indifferent:
He likes them, some other's do, some other's don't. Get over it peeps as he's not gonna change them! And being rude about them just isn't on, so if anyone else fanices a pop I will just remove it! :happy2:
The issue of weather we like them or not isn't the issue - what IS an important issue is that someone is trying to post some WRONG information as FACT - when it categorically is NOT FACT.
Or is a certain poster still of the opinion that Audi are making ILLEGAL cars?
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99% of stuff people post on the internet is probably a little far off FACT but if you feel the need to right that wrong then fill your boots Sean! :smiley:
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Edit: Greeners beat me too it, but anyway here's my comments on this.
^^^ Chill out T_T.
You more than most should know Robin will be Robin with his views on things, especially DRL's.
The vast majority of the members of this site are wise enough to make there own informed choices about the products they buy, and I suspect aren't lead only by things like the product views on this site.
As much as I know you feel you need to ensure every post is correct to your only personal standards there is no need to give the old fella a verbal beating every time. :laugh:
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TT, I was just going to say the same - You need to take a chill pill!
You are just so aggressive in most/all of the posts you write
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^^^^
Gosh! I've been out most of today and come back to all this.
I'd just like to say to Sean (TT) that I'm sorry if my reply to you caused you to go off on one - I do understand and respect your need to ensure that every word posted is absolutely as correct as it can be and in fact, in my own somewhat different way I try to do the same.
In case you are thinking otherwise I am not trying to suggest that Audi were doing anything illegal - Quite the contrary because every car manufacturer is very strictly obliged to do everything within the rules. Audi are to be greatly praised for their creative thinking and innovation - Hence their current DRL solutions.
What I was trying to say (albeit in the other forum) was that Audi, again as every manufacturer would be expected to do, had so far produced DRL versions which weren't necessarily going to be future proof in their switching - Not this would matter anyway because the laws are never restrospective in such matters.
I haven't specifically substantiated various statements I've made because I would have to spend many hours going through all the documents I have read from many different countries and authorities who had commissioned studies, surveys, and reports on the subject of dedicated DRL's and how best to legislate their use.
It's because my DRL's are in the foglight position that I felt a need to be able to stand up for myself if challenged legally, and hence my research. I didn't bother to save all those documents to my hard drive.
If I am wrong about anything I've posted I can assure you and everyone else that it is entirely unintentional. As SteveP rightly says, it's up to others to make their own minds up about what I or anyone else writes in our reviews or posts but I do so with every good intention to network and share in this community - To try and give back some of what I gain in knowledge and help from others.
I honestly try my best not to misinform but I am only human. I think that everyone here will agree that whenever I discover I have made a mistake I'm not so proud I can't admit it and I always correct it if I can.
:grouphug:
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lol stired it up here ! think the main reason i dislike them is cos there is a rover 214 in my home town with them and as you can guess they look crap , and from that day on even std fitting day ligfhts just dont do it for me .
....Now that reason is one I can understand - A bit subjective but I understand.
No problem mate :drinking:
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If I've got standard halogen headlights on my Mk5 GTI and a genuine VAGCOM lead, is there any other DRL setup I can have other than RR's in this thread?
I suspect I'm limited with not having factory fit Xenons?
Cheers.
-
If I've got standard halogen headlights on my Mk5 GTI and a genuine VAGCOM lead, is there any other DRL setup I can have other than RR's in this thread?
I suspect I'm limited with not having factory fit Xenons?
Cheers.
....Quite the contrary, Pete - You can't fit Hurdy-style headlight units with built-in LED strips if you have Xenons and aren't willing to dump them.
Check out Hurdy's.
HTH :happy2:
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Edit: Greeners beat me too it, but anyway here's my comments on this.
^^^ Chill out T_T.
Had an almighty sh!t day yesterday, but yeah, your right.
But then what is sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander too! A few others on this forum need to pop a chill pill too! :wink:
You more than most should know Robin will be Robin with his views on things, especially DRL's.
So wat are you saying? Nobody is alowed to 'correct' what Robin posts - even if it is BS? :confused:
The vast majority of the members of this site are wise enough to make there own informed choices about the products they buy, and I suspect aren't lead only by things like the product views on this site.
I agree - absolutely - about peeps making their own 'informed' choices. :happy2:
However, rightly or wrongly, peeps will use info on forums like these. But when someone, whoever it may be, and I'm not having a did at Robin - creates a post with such an extreme emphasis as to quote what is legal, and what is not legal - but then someone else finds out that the said post is factually incorrect - then we ALL have a right to correct said info. Don't forget, this forum, just like the gazillions of other fora out there, will all be archived by Google, and can be seen by all (unless you have tweaked the settings in the Admin Control Panel) - so if a 'non-member' of this forum read Robins post on the very strong 'legal' positions of DRLs - then they might take that as gospel!
As much as I know you feel you need to ensure every post is correct to your only personal standards
There's no need for sarcasm, Steve!
there is no need to give the old fella a verbal beating every time. :laugh:
LOL - but I think the 'old fella' can dish it out too! :laugh: :notworthy:
WTF is the 'group hug' smiley?
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:grouphug:
It's here Sean! :wink:
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:grouphug:
It's here Sean! :wink:
Where, where, where - I'm bu&&erd if i can see/find it? :confused: :confused: :confused: :rolleye:
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:grouphug:
It's here Sean! :wink:
Where, where, where - I'm bu&&erd if i can see/find it? :confused: :confused: :confused: :rolleye:
Next to the lol smiley is this: [more] :happy2:
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Edit: Greeners beat me too it, but anyway here's my comments on this.
^^^ Chill out T_T.
Had an almighty sh!t day yesterday, but yeah, your right.
But then what is sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander too! A few others on this forum need to pop a chill pill too! :wink:
That is one thing I 100% agree with you on Sean :happy2:
I am NOT in any way saying your not entitled to an opinion on someone else's post/comments/statement, you have the exact same rights as any other member of this site.
The site is heavily indexed by google and the other search engines, I am very keen to ensure we are a reliable source of information on t'internet for all things Mk5, 2.0 TFSI, etc, etc
All I am saying is there is a way to go about it. At present your tone of reply in this thread was not acceptable to me. :happy2:
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Is your seat falling apart on the right hand side of the picture??
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FTrack%2FSchroth_rearfix.jpg&hash=56c59048fcefe37e20addd7b7d0ad23244503e0e)
....Went to see my upholstery friend and he just got a blunt edge and pushed it back in. So I now know how to sort it if it happens again. A hard 15-lap session at Spa is possibly what did it!
Thanks again for spotting it - I'm never in the back of my car and hadn't noticed it (though I vacuumed the interior the other day) :drinking:
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- look at 3.12 - dipped headlamps AND DRLs on. :wink:
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- look at 3.12 - dipped headlamps AND DRLs on. :wink:
....Yes, but I've only ever said that my aftermarket Hella's state mine should be wired/switched the way they are and that they (Hella) quote a Euro rule. I'm not saying that Audi are illegal.
Discussion in some countries has suggested and proposed that DRL's should only be dedicated and auto-switched like mine are. and some bodies/groups have been against this idea. Audi have worked within the manufacturer's rules which they have been subjected to and done so with great style and panache imo.
Please, do we have to continue debating this detail? I'm thinking that I haven't explained myself in a way which you understand and that unfortunately you may be also taking some of my sentences out of context.
-
- look at 3.12 - dipped headlamps AND DRLs on. :wink:
....Yes, but I've only ever said that my aftermarket Hella's state mine should be wired/switched the way they are and that they (Hella) quote a Euro rule. I'm not saying that Audi are illegal.
Discussion in some countries has suggested and proposed that DRL's should only be dedicated and auto-switched like mine are. and some bodies/groups have been against this idea. Audi have worked within the manufacturer's rules which they have been subjected to and done so with great style and panache imo.
Please, do we have to continue debating this detail? I'm thinking that I haven't explained myself in a way which you understand and that unfortunately you may be also taking some of my sentences out of context.
I think we can put it to bed now! :happy2: :smiley:
I just posted the Audi link because it has been the first time I actually found the two working together. :wink:
Finally, just one other uber cool way which Audi interpret their DRLs - have you noticed how if say a left indicator is flashing, then the corresponding left DRL LEDs actually dim quite a bit compared to those on the other side - very clever, and very thoughtful. :happy2:
Anyway, have a glass of grape juice on me! :drinking: :grouphug:
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RR, how feasible with x amount of work is it to enable the full beam DRL like some Audi models (A6/A3's) on Mk5's?
If I need to purchase extra CANBUS modules, I don't mind a bit of work involved if an end result is achievable. This for me would be something I'd like because I'm limited as I don't have factory Xenons (North US DRLs are a no go).
Ta,
Pete.
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^^^^
Hi Pete,
When you say "the full beam DRL like some Audi models (A6/A3's)" I assume you mean the LED strips? Or do you mean enabling the Mk5 headlight units to function as DRL's like the Mk6 as opposed to the Golf R's dedicated DRL's?
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RR, evening sir.
Not the dedicated DRL strips. Like you, I'm not a big fan of butchering the panels and wiring to make them fit in properly. I also don't really want that look.
Like the Audi A3 8P's and latest but one gen A6, they use the full beam bulbs (at least I think so) as DRL's which I like. The S3 8P also has it, like gazbut's and JonnyC's iirc?
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fphotos.autoexpress.co.uk%2Fimages%2Ffront_picture_library_UK%2Fdir_416%2Fcar_photo_208101_5.jpg&hash=b71c587ce31fec3d2ec4d4ee34cad86c44f5fb27)
Cheers.
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when i saw this thread i thought, oh no, i hate the strips, cant believe they put them on 997s now!!! have to say they look good red :happy2:
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^^^^
Pete,
There's a thread on Tyresmoke all about what I think you may be after:
Linky : - How To Fit LED's RS4 B7 DRLs.... (http://www.tyresmoke.net/forum/audi-rs/100461-how-fit-leds-rs4-b7-drls.html)
HTH. Otherwise check out the Audi forums, cos I don't know the answer :happy2:
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when i saw this thread i thought, oh no, i hate the strips, cant believe they put them on 997s now!!! have to say they look good red :happy2:
....Thank you, kind sir! :drinking:
They are somewhat 'marmite' but everyone knows only too well that I like mine and I believe in their use.
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^^^^
Pete,
There's a thread on Tyresmoke all about what I think you may be after:
Linky : - How To Fit LED's RS4 B7 DRLs.... (http://www.tyresmoke.net/forum/audi-rs/100461-how-fit-leds-rs4-b7-drls.html)
HTH. Otherwise check out the Audi forums, cos I don't know the answer :happy2:
Thanks RR.
That fella on the link has replaced his yellow beams with a Xenon/white look beam.
I simply want to the use the full beams as DRL's with the bulbs I've already got, just like the Rs4 and other Audis with the same feature (I'm right in saying they are the full beam bulbs aren't I?)
I think what I'm referring to is the high-beam or 'Hi-Beam' DRL.
I don't think it can be done as I've checked all the VAGCOM modules, but obviously purchasing an upgraded module might do the trick, but I don't know anything about what's involved with that hence my question :smiley:
Pete.
-
^^^^
Sorry Pete - I don't know any answers to what you want.
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Ok RR, np. Appreciate you looking.
If anyone can help at all, it's best demonstrated with this .gif that i found on the vortex forums over in the US.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdataton.net%2Fvw%2FGTI-front_lights%2FGTI_front-lights.gif&hash=546b0a5bd512c9579a32934284a6dab6660cad6c)
It's the 'flash to pass' he illustrates that I want to enable and want to be on all the time during the day Essentially, this would act as a Daylight running light, just like the Audi range :happy2:
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....
This pic shows Audi's current form of LED DRLs which are able to be switched on and off independently unlike mine. If I want to switch mine off (very rarely) I have to switch on other lights such as sidelights as a minimum. The only time I do so is for the Eurotunnel to avoid setting off low positioned sensors in the train carriage alarm system.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FNurburgring2009%2FRRR8_Ring.jpg&hash=54bd6eb381f0db4dab8eb7fc47634e3180aec012)
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Indeed. That's cool RR, I understand those and how they're used.
In US/American terms, what I'm looking for is to use the FTP (Flash to pass) as Daylight running lights, just as the S3's do.
Apparently with re-wiring (after some research on Vortex and MKVGTI) it's possible, but I wouldn't know where to start so I think I'll leave it there :chicken:
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I'm gonna try and bring this one alive again if I can as I'd love to know the answer, I'm determined :wink:
What I meant by the previous few posts was I want to wire my GTI so that the full beams are on in the day, on their own. Even if they have to be triggered by a switch or something, that's fine. I just want to achieve the look of the 8P S3 and Mk6 Golf range with (at least what I think) is the 'Flash to pass' (in US Terms) or high beam/full beam (in UK terms) as an independent light. Obviously currently, I can only use Hi beam/full beam with the headlamps on dipped beam. Pulling the stalk towards the hi beam position without dipped beam invoked does nothing.
If it's possible to wire them in this fashion, I can then run them in the daytime in place of a DRL. :smiley:
Hopefully, I'm coming over slightly clearer in my question :innocent:
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^^^^
Pete, try asking about this in the VCDS (VAGcom) section - More chance there of some info to help.
:happy2:
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:popcornsoda:
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I had a set of day runners on mine which were the same as hurdys. Did quite like them at first but after seeing Audi ones all the time thought they looked a bit Halfords so got rid.
Like what you've done RedRobin! Something I might look into as I never use my fogs anyway.
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It was a long 'journey' finally getting and fitting them successfully but I am stil extremely pleased with them. They most definitely get my car seen in situations which are then safer as a result. And I never have to remember to switch them on or off.
I think they look cool too. It's funny how many Golf owners say they don't like them but when it comes to a photo they put on their fogs.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2FMk5Meet_29Nov08.jpg&hash=a5f6b564961c3b2d1bc0f7e834787f16c6bb8e3b)
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Dont try and kid him Robin, that day was pea-soup. :fighting2:
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Dont try and kid him Robin, that day was pea-soup. :fighting2:
:signLOL:
Your right it was a bit foggy over Bills Mothers! :grin:
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seems ages ago that meet :smiley:
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so when we doing the next one ? how many of those cars are still owned by the same people :rolleye: a few of em have moved on and others have moved down in cars (mr P ) :P so we defo should do it again
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Meet in the same place?
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RR, how feasible with x amount of work is it to enable the full beam DRL like some Audi models (A6/A3's) on Mk5's?
If I need to purchase extra CANBUS modules, I don't mind a bit of work involved if an end result is achievable. This for me would be something I'd like because I'm limited as I don't have factory Xenons (North US DRLs are a no go).
'High' beams are never used for DRLs. But in a Mk5 Golf, either the dipped beams or the front fogs can legally be set up for DRLs - it is just a simple couple of tweaks in VCDS.
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RR, evening sir.
Not the dedicated DRL strips. Like you, I'm not a big fan of butchering the panels and wiring to make them fit in properly. I also don't really want that look.
Like the Audi A3 8P's and latest but one gen A6, they use the full beam bulbs (at least I think so) as DRL's which I like. The S3 8P also has it, like gazbut's and JonnyC's iirc?
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fphotos.autoexpress.co.uk%2Fimages%2Ffront_picture_library_UK%2Fdir_416%2Fcar_photo_208101_5.jpg&hash=b71c587ce31fec3d2ec4d4ee34cad86c44f5fb27)
They are not 'full beam' bulbs at all. Modern Audis no longer have a traditional separate halogen main beam (like our Mk5 Golfs) - the 'bulb' you are referring to on the Audis is just a dedicated DRL - on the A3 and B7 A4 range, they are just a P21W tungsten filament bulb, and on the D3 A8, are a clover leaf array of 5 LEDs (can't remember what the A6).
-
^^^^
Pete,
There's a thread on Tyresmoke all about what I think you may be after:
Linky : - How To Fit LED's RS4 B7 DRLs.... (http://www.tyresmoke.net/forum/audi-rs/100461-how-fit-leds-rs4-b7-drls.html)
HTH. Otherwise check out the Audi forums, cos I don't know the answer :happy2:
Thanks RR.
That fella on the link has replaced his yellow beams with a Xenon/white look beam.
I simply want to the use the full beams as DRL's with the bulbs I've already got, just like the Rs4 and other Audis with the same feature (I'm right in saying they are the full beam bulbs aren't I?)
I think what I'm referring to is the high-beam or 'Hi-Beam' DRL.
I don't think it can be done as I've checked all the VAGCOM modules, but obviously purchasing an upgraded module might do the trick, but I don't know anything about what's involved with that hence my question :smiley:
To use the H7 halogen main beam on the Mk5 Golf as a DRL would be fairly dangerous - which is why it can't be enabled in VCDS. Dipped beam or fog lamps remain the only factory fit OEM DRL option.
-
I'm gonna try and bring this one alive again if I can as I'd love to know the answer, I'm determined :wink:
What I meant by the previous few posts was I want to wire my GTI so that the full beams are on in the day, on their own. Even if they have to be triggered by a switch or something, that's fine. I just want to achieve the look of the 8P S3 and Mk6 Golf range with (at least what I think) is the 'Flash to pass' (in US Terms) or high beam/full beam (in UK terms) as an independent light. Obviously currently, I can only use Hi beam/full beam with the headlamps on dipped beam. Pulling the stalk towards the hi beam position without dipped beam invoked does nothing.
If it's possible to wire them in this fashion, I can then run them in the daytime in place of a DRL. :smiley:
Hopefully, I'm coming over slightly clearer in my question :innocent:
Not only will you severly dazzle oncomming traffic, but you will no doubt get pulled by the plod if you drove around with your main beams on permanently. :mad:
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^^^^
Pete,
There's a thread on Tyresmoke all about what I think you may be after:
Linky : - How To Fit LED's RS4 B7 DRLs.... (http://www.tyresmoke.net/forum/audi-rs/100461-how-fit-leds-rs4-b7-drls.html)
HTH. Otherwise check out the Audi forums, cos I don't know the answer :happy2:
Thanks RR.
That fella on the link has replaced his yellow beams with a Xenon/white look beam.
I simply want to the use the full beams as DRL's with the bulbs I've already got, just like the Rs4 and other Audis with the same feature (I'm right in saying they are the full beam bulbs aren't I?)
I think what I'm referring to is the high-beam or 'Hi-Beam' DRL.
I don't think it can be done as I've checked all the VAGCOM modules, but obviously purchasing an upgraded module might do the trick, but I don't know anything about what's involved with that hence my question :smiley:
To use the H7 halogen main beam on the Mk5 Golf as a DRL would be fairly dangerous - which is why it can't be enabled in VCDS. Dipped beam or fog lamps remain the only factory fit OEM DRL option.
Thanks for the response TT, this is an old one now and I've learnt a lot since these posts about the bulbs and how they are used.
When you refer to dipped beam, do you mean simply the headlight 'on' position? I assume you do.
I'm gonna try and bring this one alive again if I can as I'd love to know the answer, I'm determined :wink:
What I meant by the previous few posts was I want to wire my GTI so that the full beams are on in the day, on their own. Even if they have to be triggered by a switch or something, that's fine. I just want to achieve the look of the 8P S3 and Mk6 Golf range with (at least what I think) is the 'Flash to pass' (in US Terms) or high beam/full beam (in UK terms) as an independent light. Obviously currently, I can only use Hi beam/full beam with the headlamps on dipped beam. Pulling the stalk towards the hi beam position without dipped beam invoked does nothing.
If it's possible to wire them in this fashion, I can then run them in the daytime in place of a DRL. :smiley:
Hopefully, I'm coming over slightly clearer in my question :innocent:
Not only will you severly dazzle oncomming traffic, but you will no doubt get pulled by the plod if you drove around with your main beams on permanently. :mad:
Indeed, that makes sense however you can see why I thought they were the H7 full beam bulbs, purely because A; they are positioned in the regular location (on most VWs and Audis) where the full beam bulbs usually sit and B; they are much brighter than regular W5 sidelight bulbs thus I guessed that these would be about the same brightness as a H7 bulb in some shape or form, but seems not to be the case judging but your explanation :smiley:
Cheers.
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^^^^
Pete,
There's a thread on Tyresmoke all about what I think you may be after:
Linky : - How To Fit LED's RS4 B7 DRLs.... (http://www.tyresmoke.net/forum/audi-rs/100461-how-fit-leds-rs4-b7-drls.html)
HTH. Otherwise check out the Audi forums, cos I don't know the answer :happy2:
Thanks RR.
That fella on the link has replaced his yellow beams with a Xenon/white look beam.
I simply want to the use the full beams as DRL's with the bulbs I've already got, just like the Rs4 and other Audis with the same feature (I'm right in saying they are the full beam bulbs aren't I?)
I think what I'm referring to is the high-beam or 'Hi-Beam' DRL.
I don't think it can be done as I've checked all the VAGCOM modules, but obviously purchasing an upgraded module might do the trick, but I don't know anything about what's involved with that hence my question :smiley:
To use the H7 halogen main beam on the Mk5 Golf as a DRL would be fairly dangerous - which is why it can't be enabled in VCDS. Dipped beam or fog lamps remain the only factory fit OEM DRL option.
Thanks for the response TT, this is an old one now and I've learnt a lot since these posts about the bulbs and how they are used.
When you refer to dipped beam, do you mean simply the headlight 'on' position? I assume you do.
If DRLs are enabled in VCDS (I think this is the 'Scandanavian' setting), then dipped headlamps will be on whenever the ignition is on - with regards to the actual headlamp switch, this basically becomes useless - because the Scandanavian DRL setting effectively disables using side lights (apart from on a stationary parked vehicle - which is all they are good for anyway). If you use the North American DRL setting, you can then sub-select either the front fogs OR the dipped headlamps as DRLs, and this setting also retains control of the headlamp switch (I think) meaning you can still turn off the 'DRLs' and drive on 'city lights'.
I'm gonna try and bring this one alive again if I can as I'd love to know the answer, I'm determined :wink:
What I meant by the previous few posts was I want to wire my GTI so that the full beams are on in the day, on their own. Even if they have to be triggered by a switch or something, that's fine. I just want to achieve the look of the 8P S3 and Mk6 Golf range with (at least what I think) is the 'Flash to pass' (in US Terms) or high beam/full beam (in UK terms) as an independent light. Obviously currently, I can only use Hi beam/full beam with the headlamps on dipped beam. Pulling the stalk towards the hi beam position without dipped beam invoked does nothing.
If it's possible to wire them in this fashion, I can then run them in the daytime in place of a DRL. :smiley:
Hopefully, I'm coming over slightly clearer in my question :innocent:
Not only will you severly dazzle oncomming traffic, but you will no doubt get pulled by the plod if you drove around with your main beams on permanently. :mad:
Indeed, that makes sense however you can see why I thought they were the H7 full beam bulbs, purely because A; they are positioned in the regular location (on most VWs and Audis) where the full beam bulbs usually sit and B; they are much brighter than regular W5 sidelight bulbs thus I guessed that these would be about the same brightness as a H7 bulb in some shape or form, but seems not to be the case judging but your explanation :smiley:
Cheers.
No worries mate. I fully understand where you come from on this. Indeed, on my RS4, I actually wish there was a way of making the DRLs illuminate with full beam - because to onlookers, the Bi-Xenons tend to look f.ing bright on dipped as well as main - and a 'retaliatory' main beam flash sometimes doesn't get through their thick skulls that my dipped Xenons are not too 'high'.
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Sean/Robin,
Which MY or model came with the P21W DRLs in the A3/S3 range if you know at all please? :smiley:
Thanks.
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Sean/Robin,
Which MY or model came with the P21W DRLs in the A3/S3 range if you know at all please? :smiley:
Thanks.
....Sorry, Pete - I have absolutely no idea about Audi's.
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Just a bump to remind me to look up later! :ashamed:
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Just a bump to remind me to look up later! :ashamed:
....Oh dear! Here comes a lot of reading and writing for me! :laugh: :wink:
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Isnt the North American Style linked to the Handbrake though?
Im sure last time i read up on it that the lights only come on once the handbrake is released. Or have i got this confused with something else
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Isnt the North American Style linked to the Handbrake though?
Im sure last time i read up on it that the lights only come on once the handbrake is released. Or have i got this confused with something else
Nope. Nothing to do with the handbrake. North America - actually USA and Canada each have their own differing takes on DRL regulations. If you have VCDS, you can work out the differences.
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I was on about the setting in VCDS
Im sure i read somewhere that if you select North America (USA Canada) that the lights don't actually come on till the handbrake is released.
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Sorry but these don't do anything for me, even factory fit ones like the new Audi ones look crap to me.
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Sorry but these don't do anything for me, even factory fit ones like the new Audi ones look crap to me.
....There are only two things to consider about proper dedicated DRL's:
A - Their indisputable safety advantages.
B - Their cool-factor appearance.
The primary consideration is 'A'. Consideration 'B' is totally subjective and less important imo.
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Excellent write up.
I didn't realise until I read it elsewhere that the Audi DRLs are so bright that you can't see the indicator when turned on - Audi get around this by disabling the DRLs when the indicators are turned on!
They think of everything - I saw it on an R8 the other day though and it appears to be true!
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I definitely agree with the safety over style element, but they do look very nice IMO :happy2:
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Robin,
Hopefully all my jibbering will be clear now :wink:
This guy with his Mk4 .:R has achieved it and this is exactly what I was looking to do (although in reality I don't have the right controller module to allow VAGCOM to know about it)
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4948562-HID-daytime-running-lights&p=66553431
That then gives the look of the DRL bulbs that the Audis without the fairylight strips have, which I think works just as well. The lower spec A5's, pre facelift S3's and B7 A4's (with Xenons) use this style of DRL.
Fairy lights wouldn't suit my car as it would just look like a cheap bodge mod, so I was always pursuing this method and style but it's not easy to explain unfortunately. Hopefully now that sheds some light.
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^^^^
Those are very much like the Golf Mk6 'DRL's. Personally I prefer the LED fairy lights as they are a little stronger. But it's good that you can achieve what you want :happy2:.
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^^ On the right car, definitely, I'd agree with you. They're more vibrant and are sharper.
The HID style beam 50% ones though I reckon would work on any car, whereas obviously the fairy lights are an acquired taste and wouldn't suit/fit any car.
As I had a few cracks at explaining, all I wanted was something a little brighter than conventional sidelights and I've in fact just tried some 100 lumens LED Xenon sidelights to run during the day. I'll update my members ride thread with the pics of them illuminated from daylight and at nighttime, but I think they're proving to be not as bright as I wanted for the daytime. I've decided that's the last set of aftermarket sidelights I buy for the GTI now. I think they're the sixth set :P
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cant wait to fit drls on mine, im going for the skoda vrs ones, going to run from iginition but as sooon as sidelight/main beam comes on they will dim to 50% just like factory cars
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http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?4948562-HID-daytime-running-lights&p=66553431
Come on then guys, how easy would it be to achieve this?
I may start a new thread on it to gather thoughts and opinions, but that's the kind of DRL I've been looking for all along. It's bit of a third party mod and probably no-one else in the World has tried it other than the US guy in the link, but is it feasible?
Would anyone on here have the skills to achieve it? :happy2:
Thanks!
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I didn't realise until I read it elsewhere that the Audi DRLs are so bright that you can't see the indicator when turned on - Audi get around this by disabling the DRLs when the indicators are turned on!
Audi don't actually 'disable' the DRLs when the indicators are on - they merely dim them (by about 50%) - and only on the side the indicators are on.
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Hey Robin, Whats your opinion on these DRL's on eBay???
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/DRL-LED-Day-Lights-VW-Golf-MK4-MK5-MK6-GTI-Lupo-3-4-5-6-/170547228419?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item27b5682f03
I haven't got the open foglamp grilles so once you decide where to attach the 6drl lamp hosing you could just cut out the 6 diagonal holes needed.
I don't know if the housing and the spacing between the led's would match the holes in the vents, but they could???
Also getting the housing to sit flush behind the grill holes and look good at the same time might be tricky.
Just a thought I had......Might look pants. :ashamed:
Here is a few pics of yours that I had a play with.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi612.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt210%2Fmonte0797%2FDRL_Hella_explore2.jpg&hash=155f50ae28415185718e8b347365a29ea7767bb3)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi612.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ftt210%2Fmonte0797%2FDRL_Hella_explore3.jpg&hash=7c2e929b3229d829c969fdbae1fd3b93c46755bf)
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^^^^
That's quite clever and tidy but because the bulbs are each separated visually they will look 'diamonte bling' when switched off, as in your mock-up. Could be great on a show car though.
I'd also want to check the quality of them compared with sealed units from the likes of Hella.
I think that the ones currently being discussed in the other thread are a much better solution:
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FPND8162%2FCar_pics%2FDSCN3171.jpg&hash=d0c75d22d9b0526e71838ecd9c631ca0d946e180)
http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,20738.0.html
^ I'll be including info on these in my original review post in due course.
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Robin,
I think the new fabia vRS has the same DRL as yours :smiley:
I have not seen one on the road but the foglight area the light looks like a cluster of LEDs like yours :happy2:
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Robin,
I think the new fabia vRS has the same DRL as yours :smiley:
I have not seen one on the road but the foglight area the light looks like a cluster of LEDs like yours :happy2:
....Interesting :happy2:
This illustration clearly shows a 4-bulb LED DRL unit in the usual foglight position like mine. There's folks on Briskoda (I'm not registered there) wanting to retro fit these DRL's.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Flistersgroup.co.uk%2Fimg%2Fv%2Fc%2Fnew%2Flarge%2F48262%2FNew_Skoda_Fabia_Hatchback_1.4_TSI_vRS_5dr_DSG.jpg&hash=95ab799d637f0d217016667612caead754a48918)
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Yep there are as ive given people the part no in the past :laugh:
They are £65ish quid each iirc
You can get the same thing for an Octavia Scout and I'm pretty sure it would fit the Octavia vRS as it "looks" to be an identical housing (the scout one not the Fabia).
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Yep there are as ive given people the part no in the past :laugh:
They are £65ish quid each iirc
You can get the same thing for an Octavia Scout and I'm pretty sure it would fit the Octavia vRS as it "looks" to be an identical housing (the scout one not the Fabia).
The Octavia has strips though doesnt it (which I think are Philips OEM)?
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.slamit.net%2Ftuotekuvat%2F450x450%2Foctavia_RS_DRL.jpg&hash=68bbdd988177a9a3f7c942d7e053bc7ee71f87cd)
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Yes the Octavia does but there is an option for foglight style ones on the Octavia Scout (Skoda equiv of the Audi All-Road)
The Pre-Face Lift vRS doesn't have DRL.
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Carl, how much are the vRS strips?
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The OEM ones are approximate £150 Each. Part No.s are (1 left and 1 right)
1Z0 941 067
1Z0 941 068
You can get ones like I have installed though for £35 from here
Click Moi (http://www.hids-direct.co.uk/drl-smd-led-units/drl-high-power-smd-5-led-daytime-running-lamps-emark-p-469.html)
This is what they look like fitted & working (ignore the holes they were from a previous test)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fww275%2FTaufe%2FIMG_0102.jpg&hash=a5dde64209be6c8ede8e9effb3d08f96b73999b0)
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Thanks Carl, and looking good. I've been looking at the Philips kit myself but would like to keep things OEM if possible.
As I have an R32, the slatted from grills lend themselves to the strips rather than the fog light/spots. However, I'm not a fan of the S6 units as I think they are just too much. And it's already been done several times over.
Do you have access to the dimensions of the vRS units?
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I don't mate sorry and ETKA doesn't list the size of each unit either :sad1:
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As I have an R32, the slatted from grills lend themselves to the strips rather than the fog light/spots. However, I'm not a fan of the S6 units as I think they are just too much. And it's already been done several times over.
....In my web surfing travels when I was researching how to do mine, I came across S6 units on Mk5 R32's and a How-To (in German IIRC) which had lots of pics and showed cutting of metalwork. In other words not too straightforward. I don't have a link anymore.
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The OEM ones are approximate £150 Each. Part No.s are (1 left and 1 right)
1Z0 941 067
1Z0 941 068
You can get ones like I have installed though for £35 from here
Click Moi (http://www.hids-direct.co.uk/drl-smd-led-units/drl-high-power-smd-5-led-daytime-running-lamps-emark-p-469.html)
Carl would I be right in saying the ones you have don't dim when the headlights come on?? Iv been toying with the idea of these in my GT fog grilles. How do you think they would fit?
This is what they look like fitted & working (ignore the holes they were from a previous test)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fww275%2FTaufe%2FIMG_0102.jpg&hash=a5dde64209be6c8ede8e9effb3d08f96b73999b0)
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^^^^
Yes mate you can make them dim when the headlights come on. I haven't but Dave (Muckipup) has done it with his. :happy2:
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Sorry about that dodgy post! The reply box goes weird on my phone! Ah so you can get them to dim, Ill have to consider these then. Cheers Carl :drinking:
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You get supplied 3 wires. Red, Black & Yellow. The Yellow wire determines wether they dim or not.
This is what Dave did to achieve it.
Quick update - the advice I gave regarding connecting the yellow DRL wire to the yellow/black on the car was based on the car with ignition on / engine off.
I fitted the DRLs today and wired them as mentioned previously and noticed that having the engine running gave a slightly different result. The next six pics are:
1. Ignition on / engine off / no lights
2. Ignition on / engine off / side lights
3. Ignition on / engine off / main lights
4. Engine on / no lights
5. Engine on / side lights
6. Engine on / main lights
Spot the difference between 3 and 6....with the engine running, when switching on the main beam, the DRL goes dim instead of going completely off. Not sure if I prefer this or not. I may get the multimeter out and test things again but with the engine running this time :ashamed: However, I'd be interested to hear opinions - DRLs dimmed with main beam or off???
1.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Flh5.ggpht.com%2F_DJyvoGGMXM8%2FTHwakvfC6UI%2FAAAAAAAAASg%2Fu7XO91ECunk%2Fs800%2FDSC_0001.JPG&hash=534bb8b525e659854bb2bb95255cbcc020aa840a)
2.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Flh5.ggpht.com%2F_DJyvoGGMXM8%2FTHwalihWCHI%2FAAAAAAAAASk%2FRDcJhMc0tdA%2Fs800%2FDSC_0002.JPG&hash=ed193c7a9954fecbeb67d612d5f61d08217f5d67)
3.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Flh5.ggpht.com%2F_DJyvoGGMXM8%2FTHwammJKhgI%2FAAAAAAAAASo%2F1C9TyBq6WNA%2Fs800%2FDSC_0003.JPG&hash=35a2ffda7082c1d141abf8aa6d4c7a6a5bbb48c7)
4.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Flh4.ggpht.com%2F_DJyvoGGMXM8%2FTHwanlH5yEI%2FAAAAAAAAASs%2FvVNDoUiJ0SU%2Fs800%2FDSC_0004.JPG&hash=dd54191a73054e2d33f875fdb26c51ba943a9532)
5.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Flh4.ggpht.com%2F_DJyvoGGMXM8%2FTHwaoV_OEPI%2FAAAAAAAAASw%2FaHByJq3ddDs%2Fs800%2FDSC_0005.JPG&hash=18c680affb1c80e87b1bd1d6be64e51a15a157f2)
6.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Flh6.ggpht.com%2F_DJyvoGGMXM8%2FTHwapbNkLVI%2FAAAAAAAAAS0%2FFM3V2shJkeM%2Fs800%2FDSC_0006.JPG&hash=58ce6b18a3b141034069d54735b4f731c64a243e)
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^^^^
Damn! I'm liking the style of strip DRL's plus fogs more and more but can't justify the expense of changing mine.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FCarbonfibre%2FRED_CarbonDRL.jpg&hash=a778b5c8b4c98064c8767d5f67af96a2b366a102)
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Carl you are a true gent!
The first thing I was going to do was look up muckipups thread but you did it for me! :drinking:
I think Im going to order a set to have a play with just to see how they might fit in a GT fog grille.
Carl if you find yourself with a spare minute would you mind measuring the length and width of these for me?
Lee.
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Lee approximate Dimensions are:
Width 190mm
Height 30mm
Depth 35mm
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Thanks Carl,
Ill have a measure up :happy2:
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As I have an R32, the slatted from grills lend themselves to the strips rather than the fog light/spots. However, I'm not a fan of the S6 units as I think they are just too much. And it's already been done several times over.
....In my web surfing travels when I was researching how to do mine, I came across S6 units on Mk5 R32's and a How-To (in German IIRC) which had lots of pics and showed cutting of metalwork. In other words not too straightforward. I don't have a link anymore.
Cheers Robin, I'm well aware of the work required to fit the S6 units, all part of why I'm avoiding them. It's not that I'm lazy or dislike a challenge. I just think there could be better solutions. I'm looking for something shorter and slimmer that'll be a little more descreet and ideally, removeable with no permanent modification. It's highly likely I won't even go ahead and install DRLS, it's just something I'm toying with at the moment. Haven't made up my mind whether I like them or not. I might just wait and buy a Golf R.
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Well after measuring up they wil fit in the GT slatted fog grilles quite nicely but Iv decided against it.
I already have non standard xenons from Hella that have a celis light bar and I just think drls would be a step too far.
Thanks for measuring up though Carl :happy2:
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Well after measuring up they wil fit in the GT slatted fog grilles quite nicely but Iv decided against it.
I already have non standard xenons from Hella that have a celis light bar and I just think drls would be a step too far.
....Well, now you know you can always do it in the future if you change your mind.
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Cheers Robin,
Although Ill hopefully have my fair share of LEDS so enough is enough :wink:
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Cheers Robin,
Although Ill hopefully have my fair share of LEDS so enough is enough :wink:
....We live in hope! :wink:
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handy topic.
So, am i right in thinking, if you have zenons you can turn this DRL feature on via vagcom, this turns sidelights on permanently?
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handy topic.
So, am i right in thinking, if you have zenons you can turn this DRL feature on via vagcom, this turns sidelights on permanently?
....Are you wanting to use sidelights as daytime running lights? Strictly speaking they're not the correct spec to qualify as DRL's - You'd just be using them in the hope of your car being more visible and Mk5 Golf sidelights are disappointedly weak.
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no i was just thinking of attaching to the loom.
maybe i missed something, there is somewhere else to hook in?
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^^^^
Dunno - My VW dealer did all mine for me. Someone else here will know.
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An interesting read, Im still in two minds about this mod, Audi's have this down to a tee however some of the mods I feel can look tacky...
I will try and dig out a picture of my old Polo 6n2, I payed considerable money (at the time) for custom fog light DRLS using CCFL halo rings which are pretty cheap now - it loooked awesome - won me a few shows in fact :)