MK5 Golf GTI

All Things Mk5 => Mk5 General Area => Topic started by: Janner_Sy on November 22, 2010, 12:37:49 pm

Title: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on November 22, 2010, 12:37:49 pm
found this on BDMs section on SCN. thought it might be of interest to guys on here.

Logs are from REVO
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Ffordkaracing%2FBackdraft%2F2HPFPexample-1.jpg&hash=76e192258f36332f457bfc873ccab6a88bc92a31)

I know the guys on k04 have noticed good gains with this valve.  not many guys have done it with the k03 @ stage 2+ though. 

From BDM the purpose of this valve is it allows you to hold higher fuel pressure which gives your injectors a little more headroom. 

Now with the injectors on the k03 flowing less than that on the k04 TFSI, then maybe gains could be even more noticeable on this engine. 
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: PDT on November 22, 2010, 03:15:38 pm
thanks for posting that  :happy2:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on November 22, 2010, 04:21:12 pm
PDT whats you opinion on the use of this on a lowly k03 stage 2+.
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: vRS Carl on November 22, 2010, 05:28:18 pm
Cheers Sy,

I did see that from the Seat Cupra thread  :happy2:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on November 22, 2010, 05:52:52 pm
are your logs similar to the above left and centre colum carl?  at £30 i think its worth a punt tbh
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: vRS Carl on November 22, 2010, 06:07:57 pm
I can't remember off the top of my head and the stuff is all on my External HDD at home. From what i remember they do look similar.

Although the Cam Follower is fine as i regularly change it :happy2:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on November 22, 2010, 06:09:21 pm
308hp in the makingi reckon carl :grin:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: vRS Carl on November 22, 2010, 06:14:11 pm
Yup i'll be able to race Ferrari 550's without traffic then  :party: :party: :signLOL:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on November 22, 2010, 06:19:03 pm
 :signLOL:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: vRS Carl on November 22, 2010, 06:25:51 pm
Ahhhh just found these Stage 2+ Logs of mine

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fww275%2FTaufe%2FScreenshot2010-11-22at182115.png&hash=868567464cdc56961b760d53f05191b84df915e8)

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fww275%2FTaufe%2FScreenshot2010-11-22at182422.png&hash=1e4d00f1a3a723c3ead20363e090a89f5cbed063)

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fww275%2FTaufe%2FScreenshot2010-11-22at182436.png&hash=38ab209f95c26a0de489e20779261798e6ec638a)
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on November 22, 2010, 06:32:36 pm
so on average your under by 1-2bar there.  also noting that yours is requesting 129.99 peak, the revo logs in post#1 are requesting 132.49 peak, so in that case yours might even be under upto 4 bar as well
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: vRS Carl on November 22, 2010, 06:34:46 pm
Yeah but aren't the logs at the top from K04?

I sure K03 Stage 2+ is meant to top out 129.99
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on November 22, 2010, 06:35:18 pm
Would the revo still be requesting the same fuel pressure on a ko3 and a ko4????
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on November 22, 2010, 06:39:12 pm
The rail pressure and HPFP are still limited to the same value.  the only difference between them is the k04 has bigger injectors.

With that in mind i think this makes more sense to do it onthe k03 as the injectors are closer to thier max potential than a k03 car at similar output
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on November 23, 2010, 07:57:00 pm
hey right got it fitted and did some logs..... did you have to put your values in to exel to get it like that becuase mine have saved werid... ill  get some pics up in a min
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on November 23, 2010, 08:06:45 pm
ok dont know how to get a file onto here because photobucket wont upload it... im not that computer savi ha
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on November 23, 2010, 08:19:26 pm
ok so this is the only way i know how just copy and paste..... iv had to put the spaces between colloums and stuff because it messed it all up. so im guessing time at the start then the bar straight after.... right??????

these are 3rd gear runs from 1500 to red line.... run out of puff screaming engine.... poor little car ha

this is with the RS4 valve fitted

 bar Specified    bar actual       bar difference
,0.11,65.95,      0.11,68.68,      0.11,-2.74
,0.23,67.21,      0.23,67.39,      0.23,-0.18
,0.36,68.63,      0.36,71.26,      0.36,-2.63
,0.48,69.83,      0.48,71.01,      0.48,-1.18
,0.63,71.25,      0.63,71.63,      0.63,-0.38
,0.74,72.50,      0.74,73.94,      0.74,-1.44
,0.87,73.77,      0.87,74.57,      0.87,-0.81
,0.99,75.24,      0.99,75.92,      0.99,-0.68
,1.14,76.71,      1.14,77.73,      1.14,-1.02
,1.26,77.94,      1.26,79.47,      1.26,-1.53
,1.39,79.15,      1.39,80.32,      1.39,-1.18
,1.51,80.34,      1.51,80.66,      1.51,-0.32
,1.65,81.70,      1.65,83.45,      1.65,-1.76
,1.78,83.05,      1.78,84.08,      1.78,-1.03
,1.90,84.24,      1.90,86.05,      1.90,-1.81
,2.03,85.44,      2.03,87.10,      2.03,-1.66
,2.17,86.93,      2.17,87.75,      2.17,-0.83
,2.29,88.28,      2.29,90.57,      2.29,-2.29
,2.42,89.96,      2.42,91.12,      2.42,-1.16
,2.54,91.50,      2.54,92.71,      2.54,-1.22
,2.68,93.38,      2.68,94.27,      2.68,-0.89
,2.81,95.01,      2.81,96.55,      2.81,-1.54
,2.93,96.68,      2.93,97.60,      2.93,-0.92
,3.06,98.62,      3.06,98.82,      3.06,-0.20
,3.20,100.61,     3.20,101.32,     3.20,-0.71
,3.32,102.31,     3.32,103.99,     3.32,-1.68
,3.45,103.93,     3.45,105.60,     3.45,-1.68
,3.57,105.58,     3.57,106.13,     3.57,-0.55
,3.72,107.54,     3.72,108.89,     3.72,-1.35
,3.84,108.82,     3.84,109.26,     3.84,-0.44
,3.97,109.37,     3.97,109.45,     3.97,-0.08
,4.09,109.66,     4.09,109.40,     4.09,0.26
,4.24,109.83,     4.24,110.52,     4.24,-0.69
,4.35,109.91,     4.35,110.20,     4.35,-0.30
,4.48,109.95,     4.48,110.37,     4.48,-0.42
,4.60,109.97,     4.60,110.40,     4.60,-0.43
,4.75,109.98,     4.75,110.93,     4.75,-0.95
,4.87,109.99,     4.87,110.26,     4.87,-0.28
,5.00,109.99,     5.00,110.39,     5.00,-0.41
,5.12,109.99,     5.12,109.83,     5.12,0.16
,5.26,109.99,     5.26,111.09,     5.26,-1.10
,5.38,109.99,     5.38,110.61,     5.38,-0.62
,5.51,109.99,     5.51,110.08,     5.51,-0.09
,5.64,109.99,     5.64,108.97,     5.64,1.02
,5.78,109.99,     5.78,110.66,     5.78,-0.67
,5.90,109.99,     5.90,109.81,     5.90,0.18
,6.03,109.99,     6.03,111.10,     6.03,-1.11
,6.15,109.99,     6.15,112.02,     6.15,-2.03
,6.30,109.99,     6.30,111.00,     6.30,-1.01
,6.42,109.99,     6.42,111.73,     6.42,-1.74
,6.54,109.99,     6.54,110.08,     6.54,-0.09
,6.67,109.99,     6.67,111.71,     6.67,-1.72
,6.81,109.99,     6.81,111.62,     6.81,-1.63
,6.93,109.99,     6.93,111.42,     6.93,-1.43
,7.06,109.99,     7.06,111.65,     7.06,-1.66
,7.18,109.99,     7.18,108.34,     7.18,1.65
,7.33,109.99,     7.33,110.60,     7.33,-0.61
,7.45,109.99,     7.45,113.21,     7.45,-3.22
,7.58,109.99,     7.58,111.65,     7.58,-1.66
,7.70,109.99,     7.70,111.11,     7.70,-1.12
,7.84,109.99,     7.84,110.89,     7.84,-0.90
,7.96,109.99,     7.96,112.03,     7.96,-2.04
,8.09,109.99,     8.09,113.26,     8.09,-3.27
,8.22,109.99,     8.22,110.01,     8.22,-0.02
,8.36,109.99,     8.36,111.24,     8.36,-1.25
,8.48,109.99,     8.48,111.13,     8.48,-1.14
,8.61,109.99,     8.61,110.28,     8.61,-0.29
,8.73,109.99,     8.73,111.97,     8.73,-1.98
,8.87,109.99,     8.87,109.89,     8.87,0.10
,9.00,109.99,     9.00,112.40,     9.00,-2.41
,9.12,109.99,     9.12,111.29,     9.12,-1.30
,9.25,109.99,     9.25,112.38,     9.25,-2.39
,9.39,109.99,     9.39,109.28,     9.39,0.71
,9.51,109.99,     9.51,109.43,     9.51,0.56
,9.64,109.99,     9.64,111.95,     9.64,-1.96
,9.76,109.99,     9.76,111.78,     9.76,-1.79
,9.91,109.99,     9.91,121.94,     9.91,-11.95
,10.02,109.99,    10.02,137.99,    10.02,-28.00
,10.15,109.99,    10.15,118.24,    10.15,-8.25
,10.27,109.99,    10.27,115.65,    10.27,-5.66
,10.42,109.99,    10.42,123.88,    10.42,-13.89
,10.54,109.99,    10.54,110.63,    10.54,-0.64
,10.67,109.99,    10.67,118.35,    10.67,-8.36
,10.79,109.99,    10.79,141.00,    10.79,-31.01
,10.94,109.99,    10.94,141.00,    10.94,-31.01
,11.06,109.99,    11.06,141.00,    11.06,-31.01
,11.19,109.99,    11.19,141.00,    11.19,-31.01
,11.31,109.99,    11.31,141.00,    11.31,-31.01
,11.45,109.99,    11.45,127.73,    11.45,-17.74
,11.57,109.99,    11.57,141.00,    11.57,-31.01
,11.70,109.99,    11.70,141.00,    11.70,-31.01
,11.82,109.99,    11.82,141.00,    11.82,-31.01
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: KRL on November 23, 2010, 08:35:46 pm
^^^ You need to comma seperate the columns in excel  :wink:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on November 23, 2010, 08:38:55 pm
one thing is for sure im not going to use the turbo button again it takes the data every billionth of a second ha iv deleted loads to just get a good area of data.....

i wouldnt know how to do that?????

this is without RS4 valve

bar specified      bar actual      bar difference
,0.87,70.33,       0.87,71.61,     0.87,-1.28
,0.92,70.75,       0.92,71.55,     0.92,-0.80
,0.96,71.16,       0.96,72.07,     0.96,-0.91
,1.88,80.65,       1.88,81.77,     1.88,-1.12
,1.93,81.25,       1.93,82.13,     1.93,-0.88
,1.97,81.64,       1.97,82.08,     1.97,-0.44
,2.88,91.39,       2.88,91.55,     2.88,-0.17
,2.95,92.17,       2.95,92.37,     2.95,-0.21
,2.99,92.94,       2.99,94.33,     2.99,-1.39
,3.85,104.57,      3.85,105.02,    3.85,-0.45
,3.90,105.13,      3.90,105.27,    3.90,-0.14
,3.95,105.68,      3.95,106.38,    3.95,-0.71
,4.87,109.95,      4.87,110.56,    4.87,-0.61
,4.92,109.96,      4.92,110.44,    4.92,-0.48
,4.97,109.97,      4.97,110.31,    4.97,-0.35
,5.89,109.99,      5.89,110.21,    5.89,-0.22
,5.93,109.99,      5.93,109.85,    5.93,0.14,
,5.98,109.99,      5.98,110.07,    5.98,-0.08
,6.85,109.99,      6.85,111.89,    6.85,-1.90
,6.90,109.99,      6.90,111.31,    6.90,-1.32
,6.95,109.99,      6.95,110.79,    6.95,-0.80
,7.87,109.99,      7.87,110.86,    7.87,-0.87
,7.91,109.99,      7.91,110.50,    7.91,-0.51
,7.96,109.99,      7.96,109.93,    7.96,0.06
,8.89,109.99,      8.89,108.50,    8.89,1.49
,8.93,109.99,      8.93,108.24,    8.93,1.75
,8.98,109.99,      8.98,109.84,    8.98,0.15
,9.88,109.99,      9.88,127.95,    9.88,-17.96
,9.93,109.99,      9.93,116.55,    9.93,-6.56
,9.98,109.99,      9.98,105.07,    9.98,4.92
,10.86,109.99,     10.86,129.41,   10.86,-19.42
,10.90,109.99,     10.90,129.83,   10.90,-19.84
,10.95,109.99,     10.95,116.00,   10.95,-6.01
,11.91,109.99,     11.91,109.47,   11.91,0.52
,11.95,109.99,     11.95,129.83,   11.95,-19.84
,11.99,109.99,     11.99,133.93,   11.99,-23.94
,12.36,109.99,     12.36,130.18,   12.36,-20.19
,12.42,109.99,     12.42,129.75,   12.42,-19.76
,12.47,109.99,     12.47,130.06,   12.47,-20.07
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: martziniuk on November 23, 2010, 08:44:55 pm
Prss alt and print screen for a screen shot and paste into paint for jpeg.
What are your mods map wise?
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on November 23, 2010, 09:09:41 pm
everything in my sig thats it.... im still on standard map waiting for my exhaust before i go stage 2 +
can you see something??? dose not mean alot to me ha
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on November 23, 2010, 10:04:09 pm
thats actually impressive. you have gained on average what looks to be around 1-2 bar accross the whole rpm band, with nearly 10 bar increase at the top end

i usedf to do it as martziniuk said.  put borders around the columns, highlight the columns, right click and press copy.  open up a paint document, paste the entire doc into the paint ile, save as a JPEG and load to photobucket
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on November 23, 2010, 10:25:49 pm
Cool shall do that next time  :happy2:

Also I'm glad I never buggered up and managed to provide some useful info for people  :smiley:

As for feeling the difference it felt really flat for like the last 1000 rpm untill it hit top line and afterwards with the new valve it felt like it was pulling still!!

Not a huge improvement as for feel but then again I'm still on standard Vw map
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: martziniuk on November 23, 2010, 10:39:26 pm
Always interesting to have logs to view, standard or not. Did you fit the regulator yourself?
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on November 23, 2010, 10:55:41 pm
Yea iv fit everything myself iv just finished my advanced apprentaship  :smiley:

Saying that it's mostly common sence is this game ha. I'll get pictures up tomorrow night in my build thread showing how I did it. The hardier bit is getting the new valve started in it's thread because it's just to far in for fingertips I spent most my time fishing the bloody thing out from behind the manifold because I kept dropping it :signLOL:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: muckipup on November 23, 2010, 11:55:36 pm
Yea iv fit everything myself iv just finished my advanced apprentaship  :smiley:

Saying that it's mostly common sence is this game ha. I'll get pictures up tomorrow night in my build thread showing how I did it. The hardier bit is getting the new valve started in it's thread because it's just to far in for fingertips I spent most my time fishing the bloody thing out from behind the manifold because I kept dropping it :signLOL:

Good job  :happy2:  I look forward to reading your write-up

TBH, I am not too sure that 1 or 2 bar difference will make a huge difference on the road but can't be a bad thing.  Did you get the valve from a VW dealer (and can someone remind me of the part number  :smiley: )
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on November 24, 2010, 11:16:47 pm
hey

right iv got pictures up now in my little car thread part numbers and stuff in it  :happy2:

sorry its not much of a write up but im not very creative when it comes to reviews
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: xxx_mojo_xxx on November 25, 2010, 09:46:12 pm
So what's the long and short of this... is the fuel pressure regulator worth it on a K03 remapped car?
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: martziniuk on November 25, 2010, 09:47:49 pm
Looks easy enough sat here in the warmth  :signLOL:
I wonder if this puts any extra wear on the fuel pump/ cam lobe?
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on November 25, 2010, 10:35:57 pm
I'd say worth every penny  :happy2: it's a very inexpensive mod. As for wear cant see it making any difference but carnt know for sure. I'm not worried about it.  :smiley:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: muckipup on November 25, 2010, 11:21:10 pm
hey

right iv got pictures up now in my little car thread part numbers and stuff in it  :happy2:

sorry its not much of a write up but im not very creative when it comes to reviews

i can't find it  :ashamed: Where is the write-up  :wink:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on November 25, 2010, 11:44:08 pm
Sorry my bad... It's in members rides and tricks 2006 gti...  :happy2:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on November 26, 2010, 08:15:57 am
So what's the long and short of this... is the fuel pressure regulator worth it on a K03 remapped car?


 i think so, youcan see it increases the rail pressure on a standard car with standard fuel pump which isnt struggling to make the requested fuel pressure.  on a stage 2+ where the pump is really being worked it would aid the opump in providing the additional pressure, as well as providing that little bit more.

Also consider the injectors, when you move up to a k04 turbo conversion, you have to replace the k03 injectors as they are at their maximum capacity at k03stage 2+.  Adding this valve helps to increase the pressure, which from BDM reduces the stress and effort required on the injectors to flow/pray the required amount of fuel.

The logs show gains, but we shall see on carls vRS when he does it, his is stage2+ with loads of dyno graphs showing consistent figures, from the same dyno, so any gains should be noticable. plus he has VCDS so he can log it before/after as well
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: martziniuk on November 26, 2010, 10:09:34 am
So does this mod have the potential to replace the uprated fuel pump internals?
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: bacillus on November 26, 2010, 10:22:53 am
So does this mod have the potential to replace the uprated fuel pump internals?
No...
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on November 26, 2010, 10:26:09 am
The pump creates the extra pressure and the valve just keeps it high instead of letting it go.
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: martziniuk on November 26, 2010, 07:54:12 pm
So does this mod have the potential to replace the uprated fuel pump internals?
No...
I just thought that as the internals provide extra pressure/fuel flow to the injectors the regulator valve would also provide the extra pressure.
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on November 26, 2010, 07:57:08 pm
it will, just not the amount the uprated HPFP can flow
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Richn83 on November 29, 2010, 09:12:34 am
The valve is responsible for flowing fuel from the high pressure fuel system back to the low pressure fuel system, changing to the RS4 valve allows the high pressure system to maintain a higher pressure than standard before fuel will be released and fed back through to the low pressure side of the system.  So at idle and without mapping the valve will allow a higher rail pressure to be maintained.

The reason people upgrade the HPFP is to increase the rate at which fuel can be transferred from the low pressure to the high pressure system which in turn will allow a higher fuel pressure to be maintained for longer.

So although the valve will allow you to maintain a higher fuel rail pressure, it wont increase the amount of fuel that can be added into the high pressure fuel system, you will need an uprated pump for that.
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: xxx_mojo_xxx on November 29, 2010, 10:26:54 pm
So, if you have a HPFP...it's not really needed?
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on November 29, 2010, 11:11:08 pm
it aids the HPFP further.  there were plenty of stage 2+ guys with the hesitation at 5200rpm who used his valve to get rid of it iirc
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: vRSAlex on November 30, 2010, 06:19:58 am
it aids the HPFP further.  there were plenty of stage 2+ guys with the hesitation at 5200rpm who used his valve to get rid of it iirc

It helps, but doesnt fully get rid of the issue.  Ive only seen the hesitation on Autotech/KMD internals.  I would like to know if any APR pump owners have had the hesitation?
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Sagild on November 30, 2010, 07:26:24 am
i'm with apr pump and no issue here.. Only when i had the carbonio on because it ran out of air... now with BSH there's no problem...
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: danishmkvgti on November 30, 2010, 09:23:19 am
I have had and have the problem. It got better by fitting the RS4 valve, but my software requires a lambda value of 0,75 (std. ED30 is 0,83) This value are the reason for my system not being able to flow enough fuel with APR HPFP and RS4 valve, so at app. 5200rpm the tolerance of 25% of the lambda value is exceeded and the system (ECU) shots down for the boost until the lambda value is within tolerance again before opening up for the boost again  :fighting: . I have requested a value between 0,80 and 0,83 from the software company and are awaiting the new file.  :popcornsoda:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: laurent.d on February 07, 2011, 10:48:05 pm
My car is Revo stage3 and one week ago I wanted to play around with the Select Plus to see if I can get better power output. And moreover, I have the feeling that some time to time in 3rd gear at full throttle there is a little hesitation at about 5000rpm.

Any way, I just get a Ross tech cable so I went for some logs.

And then I found out that Actual Rail pressure was quiet low compare to requested one. :scared:

I Emailed Revo And Carl comfirmed me that it should come from a failing fuel pressure relief valve.
So I decided to fit a rs4 fuel pressure regulator valve. :wink:

It's a pain to remove and a nightmare to fit. :stupid:

I have to run more test but the fuel pressure looks much better and the car seems to be a little bit more responsive and to pull more smoothly and strongly. :happy2:

Four logs with Difference between request and Actual Rail Pressure.

Positive number means Actual is below requested.

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg251.imageshack.us%2Fimg251%2F4341%2Ffuelpressure1.png&hash=f0ded935b099bb5a6bc2e6bf90fef2c2f00f0fe7) (http://img251.imageshack.us/i/fuelpressure1.png/)

Here requested vs OEM VS RS4

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg132.imageshack.us%2Fimg132%2F5818%2Ffuelpressure2.png&hash=e90e1c231c9dbae9339b1db3d48f2156e14ddd51) (http://img132.imageshack.us/i/fuelpressure2.png/)


If somebody can tell me how to properly display an Excel Graphe on the Forum he will be welcome... :notworthy:


Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: muckipup on February 08, 2011, 03:11:46 pm
My car is Revo stage3 and one week ago I wanted to play around with the Select Plus to see if I can get better power output. And moreover, I have the feeling that some time to time in 3rd gear at full throttle there is a little hesitation at about 5000rpm.

Any way, I just get a Ross tech cable so I went for some logs.

And then I found out that Actual Rail pressure was quiet low compare to requested one. :scared:

I Emailed Revo And Carl comfirmed me that it should come from a failing fuel pressure relief valve.
So I decided to fit a rs4 fuel pressure regulator valve. :wink:

It's a pain to remove and a nightmare to fit. :stupid:

I have to run more test but the fuel pressure looks much better and the car seems to be a little bit more responsive and to pull more smoothly and strongly. :happy2:

Four logs with Difference between request and Actual Rail Pressure.

Positive number means Actual is below requested.

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg251.imageshack.us%2Fimg251%2F4341%2Ffuelpressure1.png&hash=f0ded935b099bb5a6bc2e6bf90fef2c2f00f0fe7) (http://img251.imageshack.us/i/fuelpressure1.png/)

Here requested vs OEM VS RS4

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg132.imageshack.us%2Fimg132%2F5818%2Ffuelpressure2.png&hash=e90e1c231c9dbae9339b1db3d48f2156e14ddd51) (http://img132.imageshack.us/i/fuelpressure2.png/)


If somebody can tell me how to properly display an Excel Graphe on the Forum he will be welcome... :notworthy:


That looks like a good example of a car where the benefit of the RS4 valve can be easily predicted by logging rail pressure ahead of making the swap.

It is a personal thing, but I wouldn't do it myself unless I logged rail pressure first and found that actual rail pressure was tracking notably behind requested rail pressure - I'm sure a few psi could still be gleaned from the RS4 valve, I don't think it would translate into a noticeable difference on the road. However, it looks like the OEM valve can vary in spec and a 10 psi shortfall across most of the rev range as can be seen above would be a different story!
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Poverty on February 08, 2011, 10:38:49 pm
it aids the HPFP further.  there were plenty of stage 2+ guys with the hesitation at 5200rpm who used his valve to get rid of it iirc

i remember when all you guys where saying that me and wayne where making this up and that there must be a problem with our cars  :signLOL:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: muckipup on February 10, 2011, 03:52:47 pm
Yeah, humble pie time....I'm going to get one too  :ashamed:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on February 10, 2011, 05:04:48 pm
it aids the HPFP further.  there were plenty of stage 2+ guys with the hesitation at 5200rpm who used his valve to get rid of it iirc

i remember when all you guys where saying that me and wayne where making this up and that there must be a problem with our cars  :signLOL:

i think your making it up..... :wink:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: robdf2 on February 11, 2011, 07:23:38 pm
it aids the HPFP further.  there were plenty of stage 2+ guys with the hesitation at 5200rpm who used his valve to get rid of it iirc

i remember when all you guys where saying that me and wayne where making this up and that there must be a problem with our cars  :signLOL:
yes but you also did say that your car was the fastest on the road iirc and oh would beat the milenium falcon ?  :rolleye:
good to see you still around mate  :booty:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Poverty on February 12, 2011, 01:48:23 am
it aids the HPFP further.  there were plenty of stage 2+ guys with the hesitation at 5200rpm who used his valve to get rid of it iirc

i remember when all you guys where saying that me and wayne where making this up and that there must be a problem with our cars  :signLOL:
yes but you also did say that your car was the fastest on the road iirc and oh would beat the milenium falcon ?  :rolleye:
good to see you still around mate  :booty:

You guys will never get rid of me  :star:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on February 12, 2011, 09:34:21 am
damn
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: muckipup on February 14, 2011, 11:12:51 am
I've got an RS4 valve and took a quick look at the weekend to remind myself what it would take to fit it and experiment with a few spanners and tools.

Even with loosening the clamps holding fuel lines to the intake manifold, removing PCV or, in my case, loosening the relocated DV, I still struggle to see how this could be done without some very weird shaped spanners. I saw another post on the use of crow foot spanners ( http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,9196.msg198941.html#msg198941 (http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,9196.msg198941.html#msg198941) ) but even then, I can't see how a crow foot spanner would get in a the correct angle or give enough purchase to fully loosen and tighten.

I think I'll try doing some 'Uri Geller' spanner bending on an old set of spanners before going at this or maybe just forget about it  :confused:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: vRSAlex on February 14, 2011, 01:12:40 pm
I dont use any bent spanners for this job.  Use the closed end of a 17mm spanner  :happy2:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: muckipup on February 14, 2011, 03:08:40 pm
I dont use any bent spanners for this job.  Use the closed end of a 17mm spanner  :happy2:

Thanks again Alex - it was more about loosening the 14mm connection to the fuel line before the 17mm valve could be got to that had me scratching my head.
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on February 14, 2011, 04:21:31 pm
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.golcondasystems.com%2Fimage%2Fhammer.jpg&hash=9477ec94c5b0de3306052344061ae27358ce3a01)
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: muckipup on February 14, 2011, 04:39:09 pm
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.golcondasystems.com%2Fimage%2Fhammer.jpg&hash=9477ec94c5b0de3306052344061ae27358ce3a01)

Ahh yes, a well used tool in my garage for a bit of 'percussion adjustment'   :signLOL:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Janner_Sy on February 14, 2011, 04:39:45 pm
i know it as the persuader
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: vRS Carl on February 14, 2011, 04:55:23 pm
To me it's known as Jim.

As like in the 90's Jim fixed everything and so does a Hammer :laugh:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: muckipup on February 14, 2011, 04:56:16 pm
i know it as the persuader

I'm sure the hookers would get in the car if you just asked them nicely  :laugh:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: muckipup on February 14, 2011, 08:11:48 pm
I dont use any bent spanners for this job.  Use the closed end of a 17mm spanner  :happy2:

Thanks again Alex - it was more about loosening the 14mm connection to the fuel line before the 17mm valve could be got to that had me scratching my head.

I may give these things a shot...They are the spanners intended to deal with fuel lines and the likes

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.machinemart.co.uk%2Fimages%2Flibrary%2Fproduct%2Flarge%2F04%2F040210071.jpg&hash=17ec4cd1f15df6743d326562d8d99b42e498fb26)
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: vRSAlex on February 15, 2011, 08:14:27 am
Another little tip:  On the 14mm, its loose enough to use a 15mm open spanner to crack it off without marking or damaging the edges.

Snap-on do some acute angle spanners that I use to tighten the 14mm up.
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: muckipup on February 15, 2011, 11:00:11 pm
Cheers Alex,

I have a 14mm acute angle spanner and will have a bash at this at the weekend. The 17mm doesn't look too bad to get to. I also got one of these (14mm angle head flare nut spanner) so there's not much left to do but just get on with it...If it doesn't work out, I'll have the car towed up to you  :grin:

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.lasertools.co.uk%2Fitems%2Fmedium%2F4029-4035_4038.jpg&hash=8f0d4893f13b5fca8366c5cd4df9f46259a4019f)
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: TrickGTI on February 16, 2011, 09:00:29 am
If you can get your spanner in the right spot then there is no need for bending or buying new ones a normal spanner is just fine for the job  :smiley: then you can get a socket and small extension on the go to remove the valve. Iv got a few pictures up on my car thread of me doing it if they are of any help..
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: muckipup on February 25, 2011, 10:02:19 am
Well I eventually got around to fitting the RS4 valve yesterday - it really is a pain but I got there in the end.

The bendy pipe spanner above was useless. However thanks to you and Alex for some useful tips.

Between using different 14, 15 and 17mm spanners and flipping them about just to get a few extra degrees of turn, the 14mm acute angle spanner and some old 14 & 17mm ring spanners which I hacksawed a chunk out of the ring, I managed to have enough that, with a lot of patience got the old valve off and the new one on. I couldn't get in with a deep socket though (have a relocated DV) but getting the new valve started by attaching it to a bit of pipe was a great tip.

Glad it worked as I dropped the old valve and it is now sitting on a ledge behind the oil filter where I can't get to it  :ashamed:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: danishmkvgti on February 25, 2011, 10:14:51 am
And it only took you 10 minutes right??  :rolleye:

Bugger of a place to locate it  :fighting:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: muckipup on February 25, 2011, 10:52:42 am
And it only took you 10 minutes right??  :rolleye:

Bugger of a place to locate it  :fighting:

Yeah, 10 min job my ****!  :laugh:   I was over 3 hours  :indifferent:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: Joesoap on October 17, 2013, 10:39:26 pm
Good info  :notworthy:
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: jasam on October 04, 2016, 12:14:07 am
Bump thread :)

any ideas why this happening? oscilate pressure between positive and negative. I have rs4 valve and loba hpfp.

(https://s21.postimg.org/5xoeep393/raild.jpg)
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: CarlW on October 04, 2016, 12:40:13 pm
I knew i should of took a mechanics course at a college :grin:
I have no idea what Fuel Pressure is never mind Fuel Pressure Valve's and different types (RS4) and what difference it makes compared to original spec one haha.
Think i'll have to get on google for the night to try absorb some information on this topic ha but for now i shall ask what may seem some typical novice questions...

What exactly would this RS4 FPRV benefit on a standard K03 with an induction kit if that makes any difference?
Is it something to only consider when mapped or having the K04 conversion?
Is it something that would benefit a standard K03 for the sake of 30 odd quid?
Would i notice anything different when driving the car if this RS4 FPRV was fitted?
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: ROH ECHT on October 04, 2016, 06:19:53 pm
There's no point in the RS4 fprv unless your tune request is higher than the oem or tuned request for high pressure. Release of pressure by the fprv is necessary to prevent heated fuel from sitting there in the rail when unused...would be like raising a dam...the fuel would not be returned to the flow as it should. I would not put on a RS4 fprv unless my tune was designed to use the higher fuel requirements.

May be a helpful read this...regarding fuel return: http://www.volkspage.net/technik/ssp/ssp/SSP_334_d1.pdf
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: ROH ECHT on October 04, 2016, 06:26:23 pm
Bump thread :)

any ideas why this happening? oscilate pressure between positive and negative. I have rs4 valve and loba hpfp.

(https://s21.postimg.org/5xoeep393/raild.jpg)
Not enough data there to form a conclusion, but the low pressure actual or any number of other sensors could be affecting the request. The injector delivery may be fouled as well. The hpfp may be unable to deliver constant pressure due to wear. One could go on and on with guesses. I have my own unsolvable fuel issue at the moment. My specified should be 140 BAR but it is 110 BAR. My actual high pressure will go into the 120 BAR when the request is 110 BAR. The low pressure does drop 0.5 BAR below specified from 6k rpm on regardless if my oem lpfp or my USP hi-flow lpfp is installed. All new fuel and O2 sensors and there are no codes with the lpfp actual pressure dropping points to another new lpfp. If a third lpfp doesn't fix this...then ???? again. Best one can do with so many bits being involved is to wait until something reaches full failure. Otherwise you will end up replacing everything when one of these components is in partial failure.
Title: Re: Logged performance of additional RS4 fuel pressure regulator valve
Post by: jasam on October 04, 2016, 09:57:55 pm
today was important day.   My issue is way better, I just reduced revo sps settings..

now they are 758. Before, boost was 8. I loose around 15 bhp (if I can believe maf readings), but fuel pump numbers are now spot on.  Also lpfp is now on 85 percent. Pressure difference is allways negative now, so all fine.