MK5 Golf GTI
General => Random Chat => Topic started by: MitchGTI on January 05, 2011, 06:04:59 pm
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hi guys, I have a S3 at the moment but just want to get into something abit cheaper but still fun to drive, i have been looking at diesels but i just cant take the plunge i drive diesels all day long at work so ide get toooo bord! so been looking into the clio 197 f1 edition... anyone no much about them? a first hand review rather than the odd review you read on the net?!
cheers
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I've got a 200 with the Cup chassis.. it is a far superior handling car. I bought it as a track car with the intention of buying a Cayman S too, but as yet I can't keep out of the thing - so I'm banking the money and using this full time for now, it really is easy to live with every day to my surprise. I drove 197s, I didn't rate them and neither did the press.
197's are ok on the whole, have annoying short gear ratios, long 'rack and the seats fall apart. and prices are falling through the floor because of the 200, so you have 2 choices:
1. Capitalise on someone else's misfortune and pick up a 197 for a song & buy coilovers.
2. Spend a touch more and get a 200 Cup.
Mine's pretty much as quick around Oulton as my stage2+ GTI was, and that was a well set up Golf. Says a lot of the little car!!
Pennies to run and insure, no VAG tax on mods and nigh on perfect out of the box. :happy2:
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I want to get one for the missus so that I can take it round the track!
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The f1 ie the r27 is a great car, much better than normal 197
:driver:
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Do it, Pov - they're a hoot.
Forget all that "there's something else faster in a straight line" crap, these things carry speed through bends like you wouldn't believe - that's what counts around a track.
Mine's done 3 trackdays in 3 months, it begs to be played with like a puppy!
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FUK_TRACKDAYS%2FSnetterton_Oct_2010%2FNLP_9426.jpg&hash=b6926b827d5d76a20d1f8fa4f50e9d9c456b9c0f)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FUK_TRACKDAYS%2FSnetterton_Oct_2010%2FNLP_9733.jpg&hash=5701251e0e141b3daac0e93c8dccd1c6541582b9)
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I test drove a 197 the other day, must admit I was rather impressed. Was miles different to my GT-TDI but the dealer just wasn't budging on price. Also I've gathered up a fair few parts on my Golf and don't really want to let them go (sad I know :ashamed:)
Fancy a petrol now but just can't decide what to get :confused:
Matt
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The 200s are great little cars. But by god you've gotta cain the living daylights out of the engine! My bros got one in pearl White White a black roof, and it looks the dangles, esp with a set of black cup alloys on it!
200bhp, good handling, brembo 4pots.... What more do you want?
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Oh yes, no turbo-torque here - life at 5000+ RPM!
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I had an R27 before the Golf, which has the Cup chassis and most of the options available as standard. Was a great little car and I never had any trouble with it apart from the previously mentioned seats (the cover came away from the seat carcass on mine).
After a couple of years it did start to feel one-dimensional and I yearned more of an all-rounder, hence the VW. I thought I'd miss it more when it was gone, but I don't. I still go to press the start button when I get in and out of the Golf, though. Keys are so old-fashioned!
The 197 doesn't have quite as good a chassis as the 200 with a little more body roll, but it is available with excellent xenon headlights, unlike the 200. It's better looking, too, in my humble opinion of course!
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well the GF is game, is the 200 really that much better than the 197? And what about the 182, it would be cheaper for me to just buy one of those as a track car instead of trading her corsa in for a 200!
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i want to get my missus into track days. She wouldnt drive the nurburgring, and one slowish passenger lap, after almost running over a biker who'd had an shunt with a porsche ahead of us, meant she refused to go out again so she sunbathed all day :grin:
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i want to get my missus into track days. She wouldnt drive the nurburgring, and one slowish passenger lap, after almost running over a biker who'd had an shunt with a porsche ahead of us, meant she refused to go out again so she sunbathed all day :grin:
:grin:
That sounds exactly like something my GF would do! Shes keen on the trackday idea but I think one bad experience could put her off!
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i shat myself as well :scared:
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well the GF is game, is the 200 really that much better than the 197? And what about the 182, it would be cheaper for me to just buy one of those as a track car instead of trading her corsa in for a 200!
Ahh, tough call - depends on a lot of things I suppose. There won't be much in it in terms of laptimes.
A 182 will be cheaper to buy, mod and run on track. It'll be lighter on its tyres and brakes, uprated £60/corner & £100 for pads. It will however be old, possibly in need on maintenance and prehaps a little unrefined for using as a daily driver for some people. You may blow it up, but there's plenty of spares about. They've bottomed out in depreciation, so you're not losing much as long as you don't stack it. I'm not sure I'd want to run a 1*2 on track without a cage though.
The 200 is more up front (although the £200/month PCP deal is still on) and uprated tyres & brakes are around £100/corner & £150 for pads. If it breaks, you take it back on warranty and have it done for free. It's a lot more refined and much safer that the MKII. Worry free motoring and will run rings around most things out of the box. It is heavier and more expensive to run.
From my point, the 200 is really easy to live with. I'm enjoying not modding a car, just turning up at a track in relative comfort and having a day's hooning with doing nothing other than swapping the wheels over.
If you do want to mod, then all the stuff off the Clio Cup race cars is available off the shelf at the dealer. It's buttons too, half the price of anything VAG.
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Wouldn't run a 182 without a cage Tony? Bit ott!!!
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Maybe, but I'm a scaredy cat with old cars and when the cages cost so little, it'd be a no-brainer for a track car IMO.
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Maybe, but I'm a scaredy cat with old cars and when the cages cost so little, it'd be a no-brainer for a track car IMO.
you big soft sod :signLOL: they dont need a cage
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I suppose it depends how you intend to drive around the track! (i presume... having never driven around a track)
I would imagine that if you intend to attack every corner with balls the size of a small planet... cage it!
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That's exactly how I drove my 197 virtually everywhere. The chassis' so competent that you drive every journey with the pedal welded to the bulkhead or the car feels boring. It just became a tiring experience after a while. That and the fact that my missus hated it with a passion! :signLOL:
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My local dealer rang me back today saying his manager wants to look over my car again to see if he can give me any more for it. He said the car I had a go in has sold but they do have a 197 F1 within the group, 2007 with 30,000miles for £8,995. I made an appointment to go and see him on Saturday but I'm still unsure as to whether I'll go or not :confused:
Matt
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£9k sounds very strong money, they're not selling for that by any stretch, people are struggling to get £8k for mint & loaded ones. They probably bought that in around £6.5k on the trade in... push hard.
For a shade more with haggling, you'd be getting this.. Ebay link (http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/2009-RENAULT-CLIO-SPORT-200-CUP-BLACK-HPI-CLEAR-FSH-/120663987741?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item1c1822561d#ht_717wt_1141)
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I know, he said they had a couple of 200's in aswell around the £11k mark. Might just go and see how much they offer me for mine this time round
Matt
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Well dealers hate Clios, they'll do anything to get rid and a nice diesel Golf on the forecourt is a much better prospect. I think you'll have some big wiggle room if you play it right.
All depends if you like the car too I suppose.
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the r27s do hold good money compared to reg 197, is it a renault dealer?
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i would have an r27 over a 200, ten a penny and look better. not sure how many r27s were made, 1000 ish
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Yeah its the loacal Renault dealer, part of the Benfield group.
They offered me £5500 for mine as it stood (2004 GT-TDI with only 57k and all the extra's) and if I stripped it to standard they would give me £5300. I know you never get your money back for mod's but I would expect more than £200 for them considering they took it next door to the Volkswagen dealers (Benfield aswell) to get an underwritten quote off them!
Matt
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Looking at the website, this looks like the F1 they have in stock...........
http://www.drivebenfield.com/approvedcars/detail/1769552/index.cfm#finance (http://www.drivebenfield.com/approvedcars/detail/1769552/index.cfm#finance)
Matt
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thats a good price mate, dealer too so should get warranty. think a few are getting confused with reg 197 and the r27 which is what that is. its the one i would want.
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So am I right in thinking that the R27's are the F1 models and come with the Cup Chassis, Recaro Seats and were a limited edition?!
Matt
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yeah, the r26 is the meg, and r27 is the clio, but the clios are quite rare, see very few, much nicer cars than the stock 197 having driven both, as i have said, i would take that over a 200 anyday. do it mate. plus they are holding money, as said above, 200 can be had for 11, r27s are more 9-10, think tony d may have been talking stock 197 as they do go cheap ( but are not that good) and there are not many options on r27.
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Well I might consider it if he can give me the right price for mine. I won't actually be able to see the car though as its in another branch of their group so they would have to bring it over.
Lets see what Satuday brings...........
Matt
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Thats a nice car that, ive been looking at one exactly the same fully stacked tho xenons bluetooth ipod ect... There are only 500 made so are very rare! They do seem to hold money well! the one ive been looking at is 9.5k with 20k on clock at a dealer u can get the normal 197's for pennys tho....
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Love my 200. Such a great car. Done Nurburgring and Bedford Autodrome in it. The only thing it needs are some better brake pads and some sticky tyres. Neither of which i can afford at present. :ashamed:
As Mike said, just turn up, rag it senseless. Job done. Doesnt need modding.
Mine has the Cup pack and i changed my wheels to some Team Dynamics pro race 1.2, as i didnt like the standard Gordini rims.
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I do agree the 197 is better looking and the grey Recaros with matching rear bench are a whole lot better than my odd yellow affair...
You risk is - the R27 is on the face of it £2k more than an equivalent 197 FF with cup chassis and the same options. The only thing bolstering that price is the fact it is rare in so much as it has a plaque and some stickers, you can buy exactly the same spec normal 197 which will be newer and cheaper.
Now we all know some things carry money for being rare, 25th Anniversary Golfs for example, the Clio 182 Trophy. These all have something different about them though. All Renaults heavily depreciate, if your R27 suddenly only starts commanding another £500 for its rarity, you stand to lose a lot more than on the same loaded 197.
The 197 is a great car, the 200 is just an evolution of it ironing out some flaws. Some of these you can address, but some you may find annoying.
The handling is crashy, still better than virtually every other hot hatch mind! A 2nd hand set of KW V1s or other will see that sorted straight away.
The steering feels a little dull as the 'rack is so long lock to lock, tightening up the suspension aids this.
At 70MPH you'll be screaming along at 4000RPM.. not a lot you can do about this, other than get a 200's 'box.