MK5 Golf GTI
All Things Mk5 => How to Guides / Troubleshooting => Topic started by: illyun on March 22, 2009, 10:30:20 am
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Sorry for the repost - RR thought it might be useful as a separate topic here - I'll update this thread as work to diagnose the issue on my Ed30 progresses.
Well I had my car remapped to Stage 2 back in November last year and it has been running fine. The day before Santa Pod on the 31st Jan, I went to Northampton Motorsport as recommended by Revo because I was in a hurry to get Stage 2+ for RWYB and I had not been able to get to JKM in time the day before. Anyway, they put the code on and I went happily thinking I had approx 350bhp... though it didn't seem much different. My Santa Pod times weren't that good - best was 13.67s 1/4 mile, but that was put down to having a full tank of fuel, a Revo boost setting of only 5 and only 1 go on the strip - and for the first time. Plus the front wheels were at 1.6mm so I thought the time would be better when I these shortcomings had been resolved next time.
I was getting my boost gauge fitted by JKM early this month and thought I should also get the car settings sorted and the car RR'd to make sure everything was running as it should be. I spent a whole day at JKM and Keith told me that the car was having problems. It had been dyno'd at 321bhp back in November when I had Stage 2 installed and despite now having Stage 2+, it was still making 320bhp?! :sad: Also, boost was set to 9 and not 5 as I had requested. Keith initially suspected that the code hadn't been installed correctly, but when he reinstalled Stage 2+ on, it made no difference.
I had to rebook the car in and Keith had a few discussions with Revo HQ who were/are adament that the code is fine and that there was/is an issue with the car.
I went back to JKM on Thursday 12th and left the car overnight. Keith went through a lot of things and found that there was an issue with lean fuel after 4k rpm which is potentially serious as it can damage the engine - although I am not sure exactly how and why. Basically, Keith did all the usual checks and tests, checking for vacuum leaks and even replacing the fuel pump, fuel filter etc... but couldn't find the problem in that time. Oh, he had to fit a Carbon Fibre bonnet at the same time which took some time up :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: Priorities and all that :grin: :grin: :grin: He produced a report for me that describes the work carried out which I have inserted below.
The lean fuel issue disappears for lower boost settings (and therefore lower power) and the car is currently running safely at 255bhp, boost 1 on Stage 2+ software - basically on stock settings although the power isn't stock due to the exhaust, APR fuel pump etc...
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fo319%2Fmudawana%2FStage2Issue.jpg&hash=041a4e800e8f2d83a35971668639f4e568638459)
I recieved an e-mail from Keith last Monday and he suspects a certain area in the data output as he kindly looked through the data produced over the weekend. I had the car booked in for Thursday and Friday just gone but unfortunately for Keith, his father-in-law passed away and he was not at JKM during those days. The car is booked for next Wednesday and Thursday now and I am hoping the issue is sorted in time for the GTI Spring Festival :sad:
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Do you have any data showing what your AFR is currently running at?
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Also here are my other comments posted on the other thread:
I do agree that it sounds like a HW problem and it is likely you have a leak somewhere. Have you checked the condition of your PCV?
If you have VCDS could you post some logs up? I can advise which blocks to monitot etc if need be.
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Regarding the P2177 fault code you are seeing it could be any of the following:
18609/P2177/008567 - Bank 1; System Too Lean off Idle: Upper Limit Exceeded
Possible Symptoms
* Malfunction Indicator Ligh (MIL) active
Possible Causes
* Fuel Pump (G6) faulty
* Mass Air Flow (MAF) Sensor (G70) faulty
* Intake System leaking
* Exhaust System leaking
Possible Solutions
* Check Mass Air Flow (MAF) Sensor (G70)
* Check Fuel Pump (G6)
* Check Fuel Injectors
* Check Intake System
* Check Exhaust System
Are you seeing any other fault codes?
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Thanks for the advice KRL. The fuel pump was replaced and exhaust and intake checked and ruled out - although there could be a possibility that something was missed out during the checks, but JKM say they were very thoroughly checked so it seems unlikely. But as you say, as the problem is getting worse, it points to a physical leak or condition that is getting bigger/worse. The MAF 'item' - not sure what they are referring to here - was replaced and also the MAF was disconnected but made no difference so thats the possible causes checked. Similar checks were done with the injectors... Keith told me that all the usual suspects were checked and ruled out. The fuel is running VERY lean at the top boost setting and 5.5k rpm and I saw a huge spike in difference between expected and received fuel. There are no other fault codes so it is a strange one. Keith has said that he has seen some suspect readings that are pointing towards something in the logs but he didn't elaborate in his pm - I'll find out on Wednesday/Thursday next week.
I do have VCDS, but it would be an issue taking logs when driving for two reasons...
1. I don't know anyone in Ipswich who could competently sit with me in the vehicle and operate the VCDS while I drove the car and starting/stopping it while driving by myself is dangerous - I suppose I could do it in neutral, but I'm not sure whether this would be the same.
2. I would have to go towards redline in 3rd and 4th gears and this means speeds in excess of 120mph which is illegal... so again a bit stuck there....
Am I completely missing the point regarding taking logs? Is there an easier/more feasible way?
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By the way, in early March, when I took the car to JKM, the fuel pressure requested was 130bar but it was only getting 118bar tops...
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Am I completely missing the point regarding taking logs? Is there an easier/more feasible way?
It is possible to do it alone. 3rd gear from low rpm to the red line(ish). Each time you do a run just press the space bar and it puts a marker in the margin. When you have finished you can save them and chop them up into individual runs.
I can show you if you like.
Personally speaking though as Keith has started the process I would leave him to finish.
I am sure he would send you the logs if you asked.
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Am I completely missing the point regarding taking logs? Is there an easier/more feasible way?
It is possible to do it alone. 3rd gear from low rpm to the red line(ish). Each time you do a run just press the space bar and it puts a marker in the margin. When you have finished you can save them and chop them up into individual runs.
I can show you if you like.
Personally speaking though as Keith has started the process I would leave him to finish.
I am sure he would send you the logs if you asked.
Thanks for that tip.. didn't know you could do that. :signIWS:
I am inclined to let Keith try and resolve it this coming week. If we still can't get to the bottom, then I'll see whether Revo can help and scream on this forum as loud as possible - hoping someone can help. But I am confident it will be resolved this week :happy2:
Well I hope so... :chicken: :scared:
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illyun :
first off really appreciate you taking the time to share all this info :happy2:
I know first hand how frustrating and time consuming these issues can be :sad:
Im confident JKM will resolve it as they seem thorough and the best people to have on the case :happy2:
my prob irrelevant musings ........
Have you tried flashing the car back to Stage2 and seeing how it runs on that SW (just to rule out SW issues?)
Im surprised the car allows the boost/AFR to get into dangerous lean territory before backing off, usually its over protective?
Is your cam/follower ok?
Im surprised the hpfp logs ok while the condition is happening!
if its a low pressure problem the hp rail pressure would drop as it cant be fed enough?
Is it always the same rpm the afr leans out?
is there any possible fuel line damage under the car?
hope it gets sorted soon and keep us updated
search golfmkv.com as theres plenty of info on their for REVO logs (actual vs requested) and also the fault code.
fingers crossed
JohnO
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Didn't know this modding lark would turn me into a :nerd:
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. The MAF 'item' - not sure what they are referring to here - was replaced and also the MAF was disconnected but made no difference so thats the possible causes checked.
I assume the MAF item means the actual physical MAF sensor was replaced.
The fuel is running VERY lean at the top boost setting and 5.5k rpm and I saw a huge spike in difference between expected and received fuel.
Do you have actual figures as to how lean the AFR is? The ECU should have some protection mapping built in which does not allow the AFR to go beyond a specific value, I believe with a REVO setting of fuel 9 this means minimum AFR requested of 12.1 IIRC.
There are no other fault codes so it is a strange one. Keith has said that he has seen some suspect readings that are pointing towards something in the logs but he didn't elaborate in his pm - I'll find out on Wednesday/Thursday next week.
Sounds like you are in good hands with JKM and I agree that you should use them as for your troubleshooting for now. Please keep us all posted with the findings though.
1. I don't know anyone in Ipswich who could competently sit with me in the vehicle and operate the VCDS while I drove the car and starting/stopping it while driving by myself is dangerous - I suppose I could do it in neutral, but I'm not sure whether this would be the same.
3rd gear runs are possible to do yourself if you set up the VCDS logging before hand and then just leave your laptop sat in the passenger footwell while doing the runs, then you can post process the data later on.
There would be no point in doing the runs in neutral as there would not be any load on the engine. Also I don’t think you can rev the DSG in neutral past about 3.5k anyway!
Also I live in Bury St Edmunds and am willing to help if you ever need it.
2. I would have to go towards redline in 3rd and 4th gears and this means speeds in excess of 120mph which is illegal... so again a bit stuck there....
Redline in 3rd gear will take you to about 83 MPG. 4th gear on public roads = no go. The best place to do logging would be on a long straight private road, the second best place would be on a dyno.
Am I completely missing the point regarding taking logs? Is there an easier/more feasible way?
Hopefully answered that above.
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Personally speaking though as Keith has started the process I would leave him to finish.
I am sure he would send you the logs if you asked.
Agree with this. I think the logs would be very interesting for all to see and hopefully we could learn from them as well.
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Im surprised the car allows the boost/AFR to get into dangerous lean territory before backing off, usually its over protective?
Yes there should be some protection mapping built in. I have heard ramblings on the US forums saying that REVO may have disabled this protection mapping in their remaps, whether this is true or not I am unsure.
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indeed in some old posts it looked as if it was disabled but newer posts/logs indicate that the protection map was present.
not sure what to think :surprised:
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Im surprised the car allows the boost/AFR to get into dangerous lean territory before backing off, usually its over protective?
Yes there should be some protection mapping built in. I have heard ramblings on the US forums saying that REVO may have disabled this protection mapping in their remaps, whether this is true or not I am unsure.
indeed in some old posts it looked as if it was disabled but newer posts/logs indicate that the protection map was present.
not sure what to think :surprised:
This concerns me .... :confused:
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its a interesting issue but I wouldnt be concerned, REVO are :happy2: and have a huge customer base.
As with APR though, I still question why things are done a certain way as ED30 maps tend to differ quite a bit :innocent: for AFR and boost profiles etc
edit : this is the thread, note it becomes a bit of a bun fight but some interesting points.
It would be virtually impossible to know whether your own map (insert vendor here) has prot mapping without logging it yourself........
http://golfmkv.com/forums/showthread.php?t=57371&highlight=APR+AFR
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I'll ask Keith about the protection issue at JKM tomorrow - I think he is back at JKM today but probably very busy with backlog work. I'll also get the logs from him and post them on the forum.
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Also I live in Bury St Edmunds and am willing to help if you ever need it.
Thanks KRL... thats really appreciated. If you're free sometime in April I might bring the car over and you can have a look - hopefully it'ill be running properly by then :happy2: BTW, what do you do for a living as you seem quite clued up - so much so that I actually thought you were Kevin from Revo :grin: :grin: :grin:
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I'm just an enthusiast and a bit of techno geek as well, hence my interest with VCDS etc. :evilgrin:
Most of my knowledge comes from playing around with my own car and VCDS and reading up on various stuff in the forums.
In real life I work in telecoms and spend most of my time troubleshooting various radio networks.
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In real life I work in telecoms and spend most of my time troubleshooting various radio networks.
You don't work for BT at Adastral Park do you?
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illyun :
first off really appreciate you taking the time to share all this info :happy2:
I know first hand how frustrating and time consuming these issues can be :sad:
Im confident JKM will resolve it as they seem thorough and the best people to have on the case :happy2:
my prob irrelevant musings ........
Have you tried flashing the car back to Stage2 and seeing how it runs on that SW (just to rule out SW issues?)
That was done by JKM in early March.
Im surprised the car allows the boost/AFR to get into dangerous lean territory before backing off, usually its over protective?
I'll ask Keith about that tomorrow.. :happy2:
Is your cam/follower ok?
Checked by JKM 2 weeks ago and it had no signs of wear . :innocent:
Im surprised the hpfp logs ok while the condition is happening!
Same here :rolleye:
if its a low pressure problem the hp rail pressure would drop as it cant be fed enough?
Don't know if this has been looked at.
Is it always the same rpm the afr leans out?
Yes, approximately... :sad:
is there any possible fuel line damage under the car?
I'll get JKM to check... :happy2:
hope it gets sorted soon and keep us updated
search golfmkv.com as theres plenty of info on their for REVO logs (actual vs requested) and also the fault code.
fingers crossed
JohnO
Thanks for the comments/advice :wink:
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In real life I work in telecoms and spend most of my time troubleshooting various radio networks.
You don't work for BT at Adastral Park do you?
Nope, although BT are one of our customers. I don't have much contact with them.
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In real life I work in telecoms and spend most of my time troubleshooting various radio networks.
You don't work for BT at Adastral Park do you?
Nope, although BT are one of our customers. I don't have much contact with them.
You lucky man... I worked for Alcatel-Lucent for 4 1/2 years - 3 1/2 of them on site at Adastral on 21CN. Now I am contracting for Virgin Media as a Network Architect/Designer/General Dogsbody.
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Cool, I am currently working for Nokia Siemens Networks. :happy2:
Where are Virgin Media based, are they close by?
No.... Hook (near Reading) :sad:
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Right, the car was in for a couple more days at JKM this week and this is what they found...
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fo319%2Fmudawana%2F003.jpg&hash=4a728f02e219db14a5abbb4c184f67b62f45d174)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fo319%2Fmudawana%2F004.jpg&hash=70f829fbcba93567fe3f3e618b5be8feb074d12e)
As for their labour charges, JKM charged less than 2 hours labour, while the car was with them for two days and I am sure that the car was worked on for longer than that :happy2:
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Anyone having problems reading that? Its ok for me - just about.
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Just about readable at the top.
Youve put the same page twice though?
Cheers,
Dan
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Youve put the same page twice though?
Ahh, yes... ehem. Now sorted :embarrassed:
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Interesting reading.
Im having an issue currently which the car seems quite lean. The ECU is adapting wrongly for some reason it seems. possibly a dodgy sensors.
Its ok after I reset the ECU, but then slowly adapts to this lean condition, over 10-15minutes. no fault codes though. Havent monitored the injection timing yet. might be a good avenue to explore. Ive recently had new injectors and software so am in talks with APR about that.
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Speaking to Keith at JKM, he asked me if I had disconnected my battery at any stage... I thought about it for a second and confirmed that when I did the S3 i/c job myself, the battery had been disconnected. Keith said that this would have reset the Revo settings to F=0, T=0 and B=0. I didn't realise this at the time and straight after the job, drove it down to VWR in Milton Keynes from Birmingham to have the Quaife fitted. The car stayed there for a couple of days and I picked it up to take it down to JKM for the Stage 2+ remap :evilgrin:
I was forced to fill up with fuel from South Mimms (BP Ultimate which I think is shyte - first time I had ever used it in the car - it always gets V-Power) and the engine warning light came on 5 miles after filling up. Anyway, I didn't make it to JKM in time and ended up getting Northampton Motorsport to apply the map the next day where I asked for boost to be set to 5. That night I checked the engine warning with VAG-COM and from the date//time and mileage, worked out that the issue occured while it was at VWR - just before I picked it up. The Quaife was probably tested by VWR before I picked my car up and naturally, they would have given it some to make sure everything was working ok...
This brings me back to what Keith from JKM said.... he said that if the Revo settings were on 0,0,0 then it would mean that the timing may cause issues if the car was driven hard - not sure why although he did explain why but I've forgotten. I had lean fuel and excess fuel warnings on VAGCOM and I reckon that an inital fuelling issue has had knock on effects and maybe damaged the injectors and associated parts like the fuel pressure limiting valve which may have been subject to very high fuel pressures following the Stage 2+ remap at Northampton Motorsports.... maybe the cause isn't one, but several and the damage has been caused to involved parts of the fuelling system... of course, this is speculation, but JKM have replaced a few bits of the fuelling system and now have narrowed down to the injectors, so it seems to make sense. I'll find out next week when the injectors are tested and replaced.
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The Quaife was probably tested by VWR before I picked my car up and naturally, they would have given it some to make sure everything was working ok...
This brings me back to what Keith from JKM said.... he said that if the Revo settings were on 0,0,0 then it would mean that the timing may cause issues if the car was driven hard - not sure why although he did explain why but I've forgotten.
....VWR will have most definitely tested the newly installed Quaife before handing your car back to you - You would want that to be done, I'm sure.
What I don't understand is why, according to Keith/JKM, issues may have been caused after Revo automatically reset itself to 'stock' (0,0,0) as it always does on a battery disconnection - Surely the ECU still applies its own engine protective measures. Obviously I'm not as expert as Keith and it would be useful to know the detail.
You're like me, illyun - I understand when it's all explained at the time but unless I make notes it's soon forgotten!
Looking forward to seeing you again at The Pod this Sunday :happy2:
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so JKM reckons VWR have buggered the car when ragging it testing the LSD???
sorry but if Revo settings got reverted back to 0,0,0, its in stock mode.
ragging it should NOT damage anything. Even with the settings at zero, the map should be "safe", as in boost/timing/fuel are all in tune for stock mode.
now if the settings were changed to 0,9,0, then i can kinda understand there may be a problem. but even then, I think the car would run like pants and just go into limp mode immediately.
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so JKM reckons VWR have buggered the car when ragging it testing the LSD???
....I doubt very much that JKM are saying that.
Also VWR won't have touched the tuning settings in changing the diff, even if they could.
With all the self-protective engine management systems it's extremely difficult to bugger the car just by 'ragging' it - As you (chungster) also believe.
All the reputable tuners take very particular care not to override the ECU's engine safety measures.
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The Quaife was probably tested by VWR before I picked my car up and naturally, they would have given it some to make sure everything was working ok...
Context is the key to understanding a sentence and taken, in context I can't see how the above can be interpreted by anyone as 'JKM reckons VWR have buggered the car when ragging it testing the LSD???' I've used both tuners extensively for work and they have been beyond reproach up to now and all others I have spoken to would say the same.
Clearly, the chain of thought extrapolating back to hwne the issue could have occured is mine - the only thing Keith @ JKM said was that if the car is driven hard, then it may/could cause the issues I have seen (he's not sure 100% himself). The fact that I identified through VagCom ,when the problem occured and surmised that it was just before I picked up my Ed30 from VWR means that it is my extension of Keith's statement - not JKM blaming anyone. As for who caused the issue, its hard to say but if anyone is at fault, then its me as I didn't reset the Revo settings. :embarrassed: That the fault occured most probably when VWR were testing - quite innocently I have to add -the Quaife is incidental.
Secondly, I clearly said that VWR would have driven the car hard in order to test the car - the word naturally, means that I would expect them to do that as its a sure way of making sure they have done their job 100%... Why on earth would they know if the Revo settings are not kosher as its not their car and the customer (me) hasn't told them anything...
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Anyway, rant over. I do appreciate the comments, but sometimes, things get misinterpreted - wildly sometimes - and it can have unintended reprecussions which is why I had to write the above post. As for having the settings in 0 0 0, I can understand where Chungster coming from and its something I can't understand. If it was dangerous, then surely Revo would know and would have a warning with the SP Switch they sell. I'll have to ask Keith to re-explain to my mechanically challenged head on Monday and I might give Revo themselves a call... Bottom line is, I just want my 350bhp car back :sad: :evilgrin:
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the plot thickens as they say :sad:
I can honestly say JKM certainly are at the top of their game providing reports like that :happy2:
The FP limiting valve not limiting is unusual to say the least, Im surprised theres no other line of defense for high FP demands other than that valve but then Im no expert. I would be interested to know the tolerances of the injectors as to the headroom of pressure they could be pushed to 'probably' without failure. 130 max normal, 140+ spike is only +8% relatively which wouldnt cause an issue (unless the spikes have been mauch higher than 140...)
(aside from the fact that 130 odd bar is quite silly anyway when you think about it and indicator where todays car tech has come to)
As for REVO 0,0,0 'possibly' being the reason for all this I would be :confused: , certainly something for revo themselves to answer.
Irrespective of anything else , I would not expect any settings (even wildly irrational ones like 0,9,0) to cause failure. Ultimately the condition would start to occur (lean AFR etc) and the ECU would go into limp mode. The ECU traditionally throws a hairy fit for almost anything out of 'normal params' even on a std car ......
Remember the settings only adjust parameters in a very narrow range, so in theory you cant cause harm....... ? im confused now too lol
One thing to consider, does this mean that once its all fixed, if at some point in the future you accidentally disc the battery (or someone else does) then you go for a thrash (unknown its at 0,0,0) you knacker another set of injectors and/or risk damage again? surely not?
Its difficult to know which is cause or effect and you end up in circles.
Anyway good to see you are on the way to a resolution :happy2:
and the open and honest writeups are spot on :happy2: a wealth of info for us all.
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Hope this gets sorted for you.
On a secondary note - how professional of a garage to issue you with a text format diagnoses of your vehicle's problems. I mean that is second to none. Very very proffesional, very impressed JKM :happy2:
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Glad to hear about the progress Illyun. Very impressed with JKM too.
Did you ask Keith at JKM about the AFR protection mapping and Revo?
If the settings being at 0 0 0 and the car being driven hard with those settings is the root cause as to the damage to the injectors etc I'd be really interested to understand why? IIRC setiings of 0 0 0 are not even stock levels, for example boost 1 would be a stock level. Please correct me if i'm wrong.
I know that with REVO their stock map is REVO's own interpreatation of the stock map not the actual stock map.
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so JKM reckons VWR have buggered the car when ragging it testing the LSD?
I think that bit could have been phrased better. It wasn't VWR's fault the remap was reset.
On a secondary note - how professional of a garage to issue you with a text format diagnoses of your vehicle's problems.
+1. The most I've ever had is a handwritten scrawl stating in as few words as possible what needs fixing/replacing.
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like john_o says, REVO as far as i know, builds in a safety margin to allow for "muppet" settings as i'd like to call it. I think i did read somewhere tho that they do advise you take care when changing the settings via the SPS switch, and take advice from a REVO dealer should you be unsure as to what settings to use.
the REVO stock map actually runs less boost than VW's own 200ps map on my car. I get max 5psi of boost in that mode.
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like john_o says, REVO as far as i know, builds in a safety margin to allow for "muppet" settings as i'd like to call it. I think i did read somewhere tho that they do advise you take care when changing the settings via the SPS switch, and take advice from a REVO dealer should you be unsure as to what settings to use.
the REVO stock map actually runs less boost than VW's own 200ps map on my car. I get max 5psi of boost in that mode.
Wee chungster! o/
/OT
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Hi guys,
I have just been informed of this thread by my colleague and I think that there is some confusion!
I just thought that I would quickly reply whilst I’m having my lunch (Very busy here today) :happy2:
I only enquired if the battery had been disconnected as the REVO settings where observed to be different to the last visit to JKM and they where consistent with what I would expect with a battery being disconnected.
The fuel consumption was reported to be getting worst – if the timing where set back to 0 this would reduce engine torque, with boost on 0 this would reduce torque as well and with fuel on 0 this would increase the fuel consumption as a richer AFR would be requested when under load.
Please note that the REVO settings following a battery disconnect are SAFE, not dangerous :smiley:
It would be worrying if the default settings where 9,9,9 – but they are not – so please don’t worry.
JKM are not blaming anyone for this fault, or the potential of running on the default REVO settings, these are complex engines being pushed beyond their manufactures design criteria and sometimes things will go wrong.
I am confident that we will get to the bottom of the issue shortly.
I must get back to work now as ive finished my very nice Chicken roll :grin:
Kind Regards -
Keith
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thanks for taking the time to come on and update the thread Keith :happy2:
we all await with bated breath on why this has all happened :happy2:
(no pressure then :grin:)
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like john_o says, REVO as far as i know, builds in a safety margin to allow for "muppet" settings as i'd like to call it. I think i did read somewhere tho that they do advise you take care when changing the settings via the SPS switch, and take advice from a REVO dealer should you be unsure as to what settings to use.
the REVO stock map actually runs less boost than VW's own 200ps map on my car. I get max 5psi of boost in that mode.
Wee chungster! o/
/OT
Neooooooooooooo! how's it going matey?
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Thanks for clearing that up Keith :happy2: The car is now booked in for next Monday - Wednesday so hopefully, the problem will be resolved... maybe :rolleye:
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^^^^
We're all hoping for you, illyun :grouphug:
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^^^^
We're all hoping for you, illyun :grouphug:
Nah.. you lot just want to see another Stage 2+ Ed30 go down the strip :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin:
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Well its in for an 'operation' at JKM today for the next couple of days. Having the injectors replaced - I really hope this sorts the issue that has been seen on the car.
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Finger's crossed, she should be flying again by the end of the week. (https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Ftomashandmilly%2FDaft_stuff%2Fbiddend.gif&hash=1dd1185c6b80e29c9ec2cc4c6c7f3eb5fbcc240c)
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....
Wishing her well, illyun. The surgeons have an excellent reputation so I'm sure she'll recover quickly.
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Any news Illyun?
:happy2:
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Any news Illyun?
x2
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It wasn't the injectors :rolleye: I'm not sure what's going on but JKM have a few more avenues they need to investigate. :sad:
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is there any chance of borrowing a 2nd ECU from another ED30 owner with S2+ map (quite a few on here i'd have thought) to rule out ECU/software issue?
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Not a bad idea that Chungster my old fella :happy2:
Sorry to hear the issue isn't resolved Illyun :sad: Keep the modding faith and it'll get sorted eventually :smiley:
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:sad: sorry to hear illyun , heres hoping they find a fix soon :happy2: hang in there
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is there any chance of borrowing a 2nd ECU from another ED30 owner with S2+ map (quite a few on here i'd have thought) to rule out ECU/software issue?
Sorry for not replying sooner but I was too preoccupied with getting the forum t-shirt than looking at this thread :embarrassed: JKM have a spare ecu as it happens so I'll find out a bit later this week. While I am very confident that they will eventually resolve the problem, I'm not holding my breath as far as the ecu is concerned. Well, I hope it isn't as it will an expensive fix :scared:
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I'll keep my fingers crossed for you.. :happy2:
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This one seems a real b8stard problem to resolve. JKM have thrown everything but the kitchen sink at it and still no joy! Keith mailed me a short essay - no other way to describe it :grin: - about what he's done this week. I've got 7 to 8 pages of diagnostic results from JKM and they've looked at so many things... Not sure what to do next? :sad:
There's a download link below of the latest diagnostics and whats been looked at so far...
http://www.mediafire.com/?5tygzno2mty (http://www.mediafire.com/?5tygzno2mty)
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Don't know what to say pal, gutted its not sorted but from reading the report it looks like the cars in good hands, I've never had any dealings with JKM or Keith, but by the looks of the info and lengths Keith is going to if anyone is gonna sort it he will :happy2:
good luck :smiley:
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Can't deny the effort and expertise of JKM - or their customer service. But its so frustrating and I'm wondering whether I'll ever get to the bottom of it :sad: I'll leave it in JKM's hands until they say that they've exhausted all possibilities, but seeing as they've looked at almost everything logically connected with the problem, I'm not sure what to do :confused:
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how much input have Revo had?
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OMG , thats some report, its clear that there are a only a few places that would go to these lengths to sort this out, JKM are :happy2:
Clutching at straws from reading the doc, I considered a flow reduction somewhere between pump and injectors (if thats possible)
Pump etc can supply but on the other side injectors flat out trying to add more fuel (which isnt there), the spikes happen as the flow reduction happens (i.e. the pipe backs up) . Would need to be prior to injector feeds for it to effect all injectors.
Anyway what do I know ? lol just postulating.
JKM will sort it :happy2: its just the longest and toughest diagnostic issue this forums ever seen :confused:
chin up
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illyun,
You mind if i send that onto a friend who loves diagnosing problems on VW engines??
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how much input have Revo had?
AFAIK Keith has been in frequent touch with Revo... but TBH, they'd do exactly the same as he's done going on what Revo have said to him. :happy2:
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illyun,
You mind if i send that onto a friend who loves diagnosing problems on VW engines??
No problem... :smiley:
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As said in a previous post, im having issues with my car.
The readings from the long term fuel trims are the opposite to yours, im seeing the readings decrease to upto -25%. Still trying to get to the bottom of it.
Have JKM looked at any of the 02 sensors at all?
Im currently lookng at the lambda values and fuel measuring system values...
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Hi Dan... I'm not sure if JKM have looked at the 02 sensors (whatever they are :grin:) but I'll ask Keith a bit later today as he's in the 'office' as its the RR day today.
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02 = oxygen /lambda sensors.
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Just tried downloading the diagnostic report, but it downloads out of format and gobbledygook. What version of word has been used?
Sorry to hear that you still haven't reached a verdict on the issues you are having with the car :sad:
If I could help I would, but it has gone WAAAAAAAAYYYYY beyond anything I could help with.
Only one thing I can suggest to help you feel better and that is to give the wife the ED30 and then Turbo the hell out of the R32 :evilgrin: :jumping: 8)
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^^^ I hope Nadeem doesn't mind but here's the report in PDF format (original was Word 2007)
[pdf]http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/downloads/illyun.pdf[/pdf]
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How about binning the Revo and get a custom map installed?
With those sort of mods and that power i wouldnt want a generic chip on my car.
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Just tried downloading the diagnostic report, but it downloads out of format and gobbledygook. What version of word has been used?
the docx format comes with Office 2007.
To view a document if you are using a lesser version of Office , you will need the appropiate patch from MS.
I always tell folk to save such files in rtf format for universal compatability of the end user.
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I thought it maybe the 2007 version - cheers Bacillus :happy2:
Cheers Steve for the PDF. I've downloaded it to digest, but it doesn't make particularly look good at the moment.
I can't see the point in Illyun binning the REVO for anything else as lots of other cars are running REVO and are fine. He'll only run into the same issues elsewhere and probably wouldn't get anywhere near the support he's got from JKM. :smiley:
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Thanks for that Steve... got the report from JKM and it was in Word format - I use Office 2003 and when I tried opening the file, it said it had been produced on a later version of Word - must be 2007. It looks ok on my laptop. I also have Adobe Professional, but didn't think of putting it out on pdf format :ashamed: :embarrassed: I'm sure JKM will get to the bottom of it, but its a very rare and subtle problem :sad:
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After reading posts over on the US forums re fuel trims out of specification, have they tried removing your Evoms intake and use the standard oem air box?
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I have the Evoms MAF bend on my car with the same spec as Illyun and mine is fine.. I think people have suddently decided over there that the EVOMS intake is causing problems lol..
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I have the Evoms MAF bend on my car with the same spec as Illyun and mine is fine.. I think people have suddently decided over there that the EVOMS intake is causing problems lol..
Whilst that may be true in your case, the fact that in the reported cases, the fuel trims returned to within spec by simply changing the Evoms intake to the standard oem one after all other remedies apparently failed cannot be dismissed.
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I have the Evoms MAF bend on my car with the same spec as Illyun and mine is fine.. I think people have suddently decided over there that the EVOMS intake is causing problems lol..
Whilst that may be true in your case, the fact that in the reported cases, the fuel trims returned to within spec by simply changing the Evoms intake to the standard oem one after all other remedies apparently failed cannot be dismissed.
I think I know which thread you are referring to.. is it this one? http://forums.fourtitude.com/zerothread?id=4133620&page=1 It refers to a Neuspeed intake, but I think some guys with the EVOMS have had issues too. Its really weird because it doesn't happen to everyone - like the OP on the thread says, thats its just his intake on his car that is playing up!
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Yup, that's one of them.
Another one alluding to the problem is here, http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4348602
It would appear that the Evoms when used with the k04 suffers with turbulence from the intake at the MAF.
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Interesting... problems such a b1tch that I almost know that swapping the EVOMS won't make any difference - the bl00dy car is jinxed :rolleye: Maybe worth a try though :happy2:
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The MAF readings are something JKM have already reviewed are they not?
If it was low (compared to another mapped ED30) then that could easily be pinpointed.
Interesting reading thanks bacillus :happy2:
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The MAF readings are something JKM have already reviewed are they not?
If it was low (compared to another mapped ED30) then that could easily be pinpointed.
Interesting reading thanks bacillus :happy2:
Thats true... :sad:
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I have the Evoms MAF bend on my car with the same spec as Illyun and mine is fine.. I think people have suddently decided over there that the EVOMS intake is causing problems lol..
Whilst that may be true in your case, the fact that in the reported cases, the fuel trims returned to within spec by simply changing the Evoms intake to the standard oem one after all other remedies apparently failed cannot be dismissed.
Very good point, but if it was that problem then it would have showed itself the instant that Illyun ran the car with that intake.. Im pretty sure he had the Evoms on for quite a while before the car developed this problem.. Maybe Illyun can comment on this one?
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re-reading back the MAF was disconnected and issue still persisted from Keiths report.
Heres also Keiths post on
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4350097
also shows the MAF numbers again
Amazing how the req fuel pressure stays maxxed but the actual continues to climb
(usually this drops back down on prev graphs Ive seen). How can it still climb 2k rpm revs later when the specified is still 130 max ? :sad:
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Good point Jonny. The EVOMS was fitted in November but the fault codes - and resulting engine light - were only seen in February. However, I am wondering whether my DIY S3 I/C jobbie had something to do with it although I can't see how :rolleye: The fault appeared a few days after - basically I did the S3 job on a Sunday/Monday, dropped the car to VWR for the Quaife fit on Monday evening and picked the car up on a Friday. 60 miles into my journey, the engine management light came on. A look at VAGCOM on Saturday night showed the fault occured just before I picked up the car from VWR - probably on their test drive. Note... its a bit annoying that I have to explicitly state this, but this does NOT mean that I think VWR are in any way responsible!!! My theory is that I c0cked up somewhere during the S3 I/C install - but can't for the life of me see how or where as great care was taken during the install, but this still didn't stop the rad fan cutting one of the coolent hoses when going down the strip at Santa Pod :embarrassed: I reckon something that I did maybe caused the damage next time it was driven hard at VWR when they presumably testedthe quaife.
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re-reading back the MAF was disconnected and issue still persisted from Keiths report.
Heres also Keiths post on
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4350097
also shows the MAF numbers again
Amazing how the req fuel pressure stays maxxed but the actual continues to climb
(usually this drops back down on prev graphs Ive seen). How can it still climb 2k rpm revs later when the specified is still 130 max ? :sad:
Thats right.. problem is Keith has written so much and tried so much that everything seems to be covered :sad: I'm sure he has other tricks up his sleeve but I just want to leave him to it now :happy2:
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i cant see it being down to the ic :confused: nothing there to affect fueling :confused: are all the pipe connected correctly? :confused:
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indeed illyun theres only 1 person that can solve this now and its not us lot on a forum :signLOL:
worth going back to std though on intake
cant see youve damaged it any way though. good luck :happy2:
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i cant see it being down to the ic :confused: nothing there to affect fueling :confused: are all the pipe connected correctly? :confused:
When changing the IC do you go anywhere near any looms etc? To be honest, if it was loosing boost pressure somehow, that could in turn affect the MAF readings etc and throw the fueling out because the MAF is metering a different amount of air flow to what is actually making its way into the turbo? Could be way off but a though..
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You know, I can't remember seeing any wiring - apart from the Xenons of course - so doubt the wiring loom was affected. I do remember it being difficult to get the pipes back in but I checked them and they looked flush and correctly fitted. Only doubt I have in my head is that apparently, the bottom of the I/C was 3" out of place resulting in the rad fan cutting a coolant hose when the car was pushed hard at Santa Pod - purely because of the acceleration. My local VW dealer sorted it, but I can't understand how it happenned as the I/C housing was fitted back correctly and checked by trying to move it - gently but firmly - to ensure it wasn't loose.
I'm probably barking up the wrong tree here as I am trying to pinpoint when and how it could have happenned and naturally, if an amateur (me :grin:) has been let loose on the car which sortly afterwards develops an issue, then the finger of suspicion points in that direction. But saying that, I can't see how anything could have happenned to cause the fault. If the pipes weren't attached correctly and were leaking air, how would that affect things?
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Am I right in saying that the boost hose connections are the 2 lugs and a U shaped clip type?
I don't know if this helps, but they get weakened by playing with them, thus allowing the connections to pull apart under boost and leak out. This in turn throws the ECU to cock and may be your problem, as Jonny has alluded to..?
I had this problem on my 150PD - you can't seperate them by hand, but a shed load of boost soon forces them and it's very difficult to diagnose.. as you can't go nosing around under there with it on a rolling road trying to replicate it.
Pig of a fault, but re-tracing your steps to last known working configuration (oh, there's the IT in me) seems the next step.
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Pig of a fault, but re-tracing your steps to last known working configuration (oh, there's the IT in me) seems the next step.
Yeah, if only I could reboot it :rolleye:
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Am I right in saying that the boost hose connections are the 2 lugs and a U shaped clip type?
I don't know if this helps, but they get weakened by playing with them, thus allowing the connections to pull apart under boost and leak out. This in turn throws the ECU to cock and may be your problem, as Jonny has alluded to..?
I had this problem on my 150PD - you can't seperate them by hand, but a shed load of boost soon forces them and it's very difficult to diagnose.. as you can't go nosing around under there with it on a rolling road trying to replicate it.
Pig of a fault, but re-tracing your steps to last known working configuration (oh, there's the IT in me) seems the next step.
On the same lines, did you re fit the OEM O-Rings when you changed the IC. You would have had to fit the O-Rings from the couplers, if not then I think thats worth looking at, I bet that would be the cause of the problem.. If not then Im out of ideas..
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Am I right in saying that the boost hose connections are the 2 lugs and a U shaped clip type?
I don't know if this helps, but they get weakened by playing with them, thus allowing the connections to pull apart under boost and leak out. This in turn throws the ECU to cock and may be your problem, as Jonny has alluded to..?
I had this problem on my 150PD - you can't seperate them by hand, but a shed load of boost soon forces them and it's very difficult to diagnose.. as you can't go nosing around under there with it on a rolling road trying to replicate it.
Pig of a fault, but re-tracing your steps to last known working configuration (oh, there's the IT in me) seems the next step.
On the same lines, did you re fit the OEM O-Rings when you changed the IC. You would have had to fit the O-Rings from the couplers, if not then I think thats worth looking at, I bet that would be the cause of the problem.. If not then Im out of ideas..
You mean those slender metal rings that came off the ends of the oem pipes and went onto the S3 pipes? Yeah, we fitted those. :innocent: But I'm wondering if they were fitted properly,but we triple checked them so my mind is probably playing tricks on me... but then again :confused:
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Am I right in saying that the boost hose connections are the 2 lugs and a U shaped clip type?
I don't know if this helps, but they get weakened by playing with them, thus allowing the connections to pull apart under boost and leak out. This in turn throws the ECU to cock and may be your problem, as Jonny has alluded to..?
I had this problem on my 150PD - you can't seperate them by hand, but a shed load of boost soon forces them and it's very difficult to diagnose.. as you can't go nosing around under there with it on a rolling road trying to replicate it.
Pig of a fault, but re-tracing your steps to last known working configuration (oh, there's the IT in me) seems the next step.
On the same lines, did you re fit the OEM O-Rings when you changed the IC. You would have had to fit the O-Rings from the couplers, if not then I think thats worth looking at, I bet that would be the cause of the problem.. If not then Im out of ideas..
You mean those slender metal rings that came off the ends of the oem pipes and went onto the S3 pipes? Yeah, we fitted those. :innocent: But I'm wondering if they were fitted properly,but we triple checked them so my mind is probably playing tricks on me... but then again :confused:
Yes those, but did you re-fit the O-rings??
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ed30 ic
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fd122%2Fmat138l%2Fs3icinstall009-1.jpg&hash=5a4f34057a456cf93b49c22ba4137331944736f6)
s3
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fd122%2Fmat138l%2Fs3icinstall001.jpg&hash=354a8383669bfec6083d5bb06f024c7aa8a40bbb)
with pipes and clamps
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ed30 ic
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fd122%2Fmat138l%2Fs3icinstall009-1.jpg&hash=5a4f34057a456cf93b49c22ba4137331944736f6)
s3
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fd122%2Fmat138l%2Fs3icinstall001.jpg&hash=354a8383669bfec6083d5bb06f024c7aa8a40bbb)
with pipes and clamps
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fo304%2Fjonnnny28%2Fs3icinstall001.jpg&hash=7f9653be02cf49b24f1656ae584851a85d4450b2)
The area that I have highlighted, that shows the connector with the O-ring on the end that you should have removed from the ED30 hoses, and replaced onto the S3 hoses. You can see it if you look carefully, slightly green in colour..
If you didn't do this then I would inform JKM and that will be your issue..
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Thanks Mat :happy2: Jonny, I put the metal rings pointed out by the green arrows from the old pipes onto the new ones, but left the metal bit pointed out by the red arrow on the old pipe if that makes sense. :chicken:
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fo319%2Fmudawana%2Fs3icinstall001.jpg&hash=cd608a1937608396f4f77f2a4c5189adedc9037d)
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Shyte... let me goto the garage and check that old red pipe to make sure. I really really hope I c0cked up.. please God.. :innocent: :grin: :grin: :grin:
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You just jubilee clipped the new hoses onto the existing bits? I'm guessing there in lies your problem?
I think you need some proper connections, like the ones shown in this picture.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sfsperformance.co.uk%2Fimages%2Fhosekits%2FTHS170.jpg&hash=feb3e1bda96242a4438e1a09325ab282adff1c8c)
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Right, I've got the red pipe in my hand and BOTH.. sod it.. let me get a piccy up. Heres what I've got:
:jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove:
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fo319%2Fmudawana%2FDSC00451.jpg&hash=d614c1740c4e1c12c855dd1f6197de55d46f93bc)
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Right, I've got the red pipe in my hand and BOTH.. sod it.. let me get a piccy up. Heres what I've got:
:jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove:
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fo319%2Fmudawana%2FDSC00451.jpg&hash=d614c1740c4e1c12c855dd1f6197de55d46f93bc)
Well, they all have O-rings on, which means your car doesn't lol..
As far as I can tell from the previous pics the new S3 hoses dont come with the O-rings, in which case that certainly would be a big problem..
Nice Beetle by the way :wink:
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Looks like you guys might have helped solve this :jumpmove: I read the APR manual and when it referred to o-rings I thought it meant the jubilee clips :ashamed: :embarrassed: I DID try and remove the o-rings but they were so stiff that I thought they were part of the pipe and not removable. :ashamed: :chicken: I suspected it was something to do with the S3 I/C
bodge job that I did. Hell I have learned a lot from this experience and I'm STILL going to do my own jobs in the future - I now know what an O-Ring is :innocent:
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Looks like you guys might have helped solve this :jumpmove: I read the APR manual and when it referred to o-rings I thought it meant the jubilee clips :ashamed: :embarrassed: I DID try and remove the o-rings but they were so stiff that I thought they were part of the pipe and not removable. :ashamed: :chicken: I suspected it was something to do with the S3 I/C bodge job that I did. Hell I have learned a lot from this experience and I'm STILL going to do my own jobs in the future - I now know what an O-Ring is :innocent:
Lets hope, its very easy to check, and very easy to solve if that is the problem! Fingers crossed mate! :happy2:
indeed illyun theres only 1 person that can solve this now and its not us lot on a forum :signLOL:
Hehe.. :grin:
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Fantastic spot Jonny!!
I have a feeling someone will be ripping his car apart into the wee hours tonight - fingers crossed it's that.
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Fantastic spot Jonny!!
I have a feeling someone will be ripping his car apart into the wee hours tonight - fingers crossed it's that.
Well could end up not being that, but at the moment it looks very possible, I hope it is for Illyuns sake, so that he can get the car back on the road running full stage 2+ powerrrrrr haha..
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I am sure the new pipes had new o rings on them
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The O-Rings can also pinch and tear, causing it to blow past - so if it turns out they are on, they could just be goosed? just a thought.
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I am sure the new pipes had new o rings on them
I would have thought they would too, but in the pics earlier it doesnt look like it..
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I am sure the new pipes had new o rings on them
Just gone out and come back and on the way, I thought I should ask you whether the new pipes had O-Rings as I couldn't remember. What I don't get is that the new pipes were difficult to get on and were tightly inserted - we tugged them slightly to ensure the fit was secure. If the new pipes didn't have the o-rings, then would they have fitted tightly... I'm going to scour my install pics... I really hope the O-Rings weren't on the new pipes :grin: :grin: :grin:
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It does fella 100% sure as I will post a pic
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It does fella 100% sure as I will post a pic
Ahh, well so much for that.. Worth a check anyways if the car is up on the ramp, would only take 5mins..
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(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fd122%2Fmat138l%2Fs3hoses002.jpg&hash=7d6c31f004f324b9eb6143fc4274b6dcb15f3842)
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Is that bottom ring on the right pipe an o-ring? :rolleye: I remember tightening the screw when it was put on...
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Is that bottom ring on the right pipe an o-ring? :rolleye: I remember tightening the screw when it was put on...
thats a jubilee clip u nut case :signLOL: but the o ring is on the top of that pipe
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s3
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fd122%2Fmat138l%2Fs3icinstall001.jpg&hash=354a8383669bfec6083d5bb06f024c7aa8a40bbb)
I can't see the o-ring in this pic, am I missing something?? :ashamed:.. Thats what Illyun has on his car now, could it be that this pipe didn't have an o-ring fitted??
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Is that bottom ring on the right pipe an o-ring? :rolleye: I remember tightening the screw when it was put on...
thats a jubilee clip u nut case :signLOL: but the o ring is on the top of that pipe
So then there IS a problem right? Because I put them on like that.... I did wonder why the S3 - with more power - had flimsier pipe connections than the Ed30 at the time :embarrassed: :laugh:
Does there have to be an o-ring on both ends of the S3 pipe like the red Ed30 one has?
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the pipe in my pic goes the other way around and the jubilee clip goes on the ic
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(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fd122%2Fmat138l%2Fs3icinstall004.jpg&hash=58b669863efc6db3902f9df34b9e9c2533bdad87)
posh on end of pipe and clamp on
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fd122%2Fmat138l%2Fs3intercoolers003.jpg&hash=f0d9bf4e2a9acf453b03cf87bf493fe8a9a6528b)
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Damn... you've ruined my evening Mat :sad: I get it now. Only one end of the pipe had an O-Ring and that was already on there... Well thanks for trying Jonny :happy2: and thanks for nothing Mat :laugh: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:
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Damn... you've ruined my evening Mat :sad:
sorry mate but its defo worth a check incase they are not on correctly
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Damn... you've ruined my evening Mat :sad:
sorry mate but its defo worth a check incase they are not on correctly
Yes, I will ask JKM to check them... I strongly suspected the S3 install as the problem occured quite soon after that job. :confused:
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good luck illyun and i hope u get it sorted quick :happy2: :smiley:
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good luck illyun and i hope u get it sorted quick :happy2: :smiley:
Thanks :smiley:
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brilliant thread :happy2: Im gonna stop quoting on forums :grin:
nice one jonnyc , although if this is the issue then how does that translate into lean mixture ? lost boost I would expect over rich ?
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Right, I've got the red pipe in my hand and BOTH.. sod it.. let me get a piccy up. Heres what I've got:
:jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove: :jumpmove:
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fo319%2Fmudawana%2FDSC00451.jpg&hash=d614c1740c4e1c12c855dd1f6197de55d46f93bc)
Nice Beetle by the way :wink:
Thats my 4 year old daughter's 'daily drive' :grin: :grin: :grin: Its got barnstorming acceleration and could probably keep up with your Ed30 Jonny - well upto its top speed of 2mph :laugh:
Haven't really thought much in the way of modding yet - maybe put a Milk Float battery in it... :rolleye:
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I still think there is a problem here, look at the pics to see what I mean..
This pic shows the S3 hose which one end (GREEN) pushes over the intercooler take off (RED 2nd pic) and is secured with a hose clamp. The other end (RED) has the hose connector on, with no o-ring, not that I can see anyways.. This end pushes into the turbo intake pipe on the driver side of the engine bay and is secured with a spring pin.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fo304%2Fjonnnny28%2Fs3icinstall001-1.jpg&hash=341aacb1a38840b54c0ff3a53e05679a1c402327)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fo304%2Fjonnnny28%2Fs3intercoolers003.jpg&hash=b9175769e93963fdf812a06e0739d51c63543ab8)
I still think that there is no o-ring on that connection which would cause a problem..
brilliant thread :happy2: Im gonna stop quoting on forums :grin:
nice one jonnyc , although if this is the issue then how does that translate into lean mixture ? lost boost I would expect over rich ?
I can't really explain that, but I agree that it would be trying to over compensate with the fuelling, it is running silly pressures in the fuel system, this could well have something to do with it.. As to why its ending up lean I have no idea, it could infact be that its just getting pre ignition because its actually running stupidly rich for a moment. Over rich conditions can also cause pre ignition, especially in high compression engines..
I don't pretend to be an engine builder but it all kind of links up together, just throwing some ideas about..
I still think it would be worth having JKM check that connection on the IC hose..
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I still think it would be worth having JKM check that connection on the IC hose..
....Good idea. There's no reason for JKM to have checked these connections already and I know that Jim is familiar with how the S3 i/c goes into the GTI.
IIRC, the alu ends have to be changed because the S3 ones don't fit.
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Nadeem, i was under the impression from jkm, that your car is making the horsepower no problem on the rollers, just not very smooth getting there or idleing?. How can the intercooler potentually cause this if she shows no signs of overheat to cause incorrect temp readings to the ecu?.
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It won't be the intake temp, Phil, it'll be pressure fluctuations.
The requsted boost vs actual received and any slight variations because of leakage will cause the ECU to be constantly making adjustments to try and compensate, making it choppy, as Jonny said.
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brilliant thread :happy2: Im gonna stop quoting on forums :grin:
nice one jonnyc , although if this is the issue then how does that translate into lean mixture ? lost boost I would expect over rich ?
exactly my view also...
if the IC install is causing a slight air leak, it will make it run rich rather than lean, as the MAF would have seen a level of airflow greater than that at manifold point, but fuel level would be per MAF level.
HOWEVER,
if it was running rich, and the O2/Lambda sensor in the exhaust DP would know this, it would then try to pull fuel trim to lean off the mixture to compensate.
So, potentially, I suppose (and I'm no expert) it could cause the problems being experienced.
But I would have thought it would be a minor correction, and not big enough to cause such a dangerous lean mixture being shown?? All very strange.
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It won't be the intake temp, Phil, it'll be pressure fluctuations.
The requsted boost vs actual received and any slight variations because of leakage will cause the ECU to be constantly making adjustments to try and compensate, making it choppy, as Jonny said.
i seee :happy2:
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Jonny if you look at the pic of hoses I put up on the right hose in the pic it's got a jubilee clip on the bottom and at the top it's got a plastic cover over the top of it and if you look close near the top u can see the black o ring going around the top of it.
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just had a look at the s3 hoses on mine and they 1000% have a green o ring at the top :happy2:
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I think its def something thats changed so it needs to be reviewed and possibly put back to OE for a new dyno run.
exciting thread or what :jumpmove:
thanks for the feedback jonny :happy2:
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Jonny if you look at the pic of hoses I put up on the right hose in the pic it's got a jubilee clip on the bottom and at the top it's got a plastic cover over the top of it and if you look close near the top u can see the black o ring going around the top of it.
Yeah I can see that, and I agree 100% that the pics you put up of your S3 hoses have an o-ring fitted, but in the picture of Illyuns S3 hoses there is no o-ring.. Thats the important one, as thats the hose that is fitted to his car..
Im not trying to be clever, I just made an observation, and as far as I can tell, that hose has no o-ring on it..
Anyways sure we will find out today.. :smiley:
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Jonny if you look at the pic of hoses I put up on the right hose in the pic it's got a jubilee clip on the bottom and at the top it's got a plastic cover over the top of it and if you look close near the top u can see the black o ring going around the top of it.
Yeah I can see that, and I agree 100% that the pics you put up of your S3 hoses have an o-ring fitted, but in the picture of Illyuns S3 hoses there is no o-ring.. Thats the important one, as thats the hose that is fitted to his car..
Im not trying to be clever, I just made an observation, and as far as I can tell, that hose has no o-ring on it..
Anyways sure we will find out today.. :smiley:
those pics are all mine fella but the hose illy has put on are of the old hoses :happy2: its worth a check
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Jonny if you look at the pic of hoses I put up on the right hose in the pic it's got a jubilee clip on the bottom and at the top it's got a plastic cover over the top of it and if you look close near the top u can see the black o ring going around the top of it.
Yeah I can see that, and I agree 100% that the pics you put up of your S3 hoses have an o-ring fitted, but in the picture of Illyuns S3 hoses there is no o-ring.. Thats the important one, as thats the hose that is fitted to his car..
Im not trying to be clever, I just made an observation, and as far as I can tell, that hose has no o-ring on it..
Anyways sure we will find out today.. :smiley:
those pics are all mine fella but the hose illy has put on are of the old hoses :happy2: its worth a check
Sorry mate, I was reffering to that pic I had posted, didn't realize it was your picture.. I give up, my head hurts now lol.. :wink:
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so does mine :rolleye: i do hope it gets sorted soon :smiley:
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The pics I posted are of the OEM pipes and the pics that Mat Ed30 posted are the ones where he did an install himself on his car presumably. :rolleye:
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The pics I posted are of the OEM pipes and the pics that Mat Ed30 posted are the ones where he did an install himself on his car presumably. :rolleye:
correct :happy2:
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I wonder if replacing the contents of the engine bay like engine, turbo, battery, fuse box, all engine ancillaries, the wiring loom, the body shell and associated parts like wings and rear hatch, the lights, the dash, seats, gearbox, pedals, sat-nav, carpet etc... will solve the problem? :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:
Oh, I forgot the tyres... they're important :driver:
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I wonder if replacing the contents of the engine bay like engine, turbo, battery, fuse box, all engine ancillaries, the wiring loom, the body shell and associated parts like wings and rear hatch, the lights, the dash, seats, gearbox, pedals, sat-nav, carpet etc... will solve the problem? :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:
Oh, I forgot the tyres... they're important :driver:
Just buy mine? :drool:
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Just buy mine? :drool:
I'd love to... does anyone want to buy a spare kidney? :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin:
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Just buy mine? :drool:
I'd love to... does anyone want to buy a spare kidney? :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin:
As with all of my cars, they are for sale from the day I buy them for the right price.. :happy2:
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As with all of my cars, they are for sale from the day I buy them for the right price.. :happy2:
Will the price be the same with the carbon fibre wheels on them? :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:
If you sold your car for say £20k or something - which is cheap - someone could sell the cf alloys, your seats and other bits and pieces and get £10k back and still have a superb car.... not that I'm giving anyone any ideas of course :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: Personally, I'd love to see you get to an optimal power to weight ratio (without going to the extreme of making it just another track car) and see what time you get at Santa Pod. I doubt very much that anyone in a Mk5 GTI/Ed30/Pirelli will come close in terms of 1/4 mile times this year or the next... unless some nutter decides to go big turbo :laugh:
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any news illyun ........?
please tell me its fixed....... :confused:
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any news illyun ........?
please tell me its fixed....... :confused:
.... x2
I've been meaning to ask but didn't want to in case it's not fixed.
Hoping it's good news, illyun :smiley:
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Sorry - its bad news... but JKM are carrying on. Its looking like it might be the actual engine block and there is a further test they will be doing this/next week :sad: :sad; I spoke to Keith today after reading JonnyCs thread) and suggested going down the water/meth big turbo route just to mask the bloody problem (and have big power on tap :evilgrin:) and lower temperatures to overcome the problem. He didn't think it was a good solution to the problem.
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oh crap mate thats not good what u going to do if it is the block?
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oh dear, sorry to hear this :sad: must be a v.rare problem if its the block :confused:
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:sad:
in what terms is the block a possible issue? leaking past rings? porous in general , or flexing ? etc
On a positive note sounds like an excuse to go the whole BT route inc new block/rods etc :evilgrin:
fingers crossed for you :happy2:
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I dont understand.. How could there be a 'problem' with the block?
The only problem the block could have is that its overheating or its got a big hole in it.. Its neither of those surely? lol..
Did he say any more?
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With regards to the above comments, I really have no idea except that the fuel pressure is ok in the fuel pressure rail (although there are odd spikes going to 137/8 bar which might be down to the ECU trying to over compensate the lean fuel issue - its running trim at 25% as it is which is why my mpg was affected adversely), the injectors are flowing correctly so that means that the fuel is getting through to the combustion chamber ok.. its the lambda value that is coming out wrong showing that the afr is too lean at high revs when boost on the revo map is turned up. The higher the boost, the worse the problem. The o2 sensor has been checked out so logically it the problem has to be with the fuel going through the engine... if not, then then I really haven't a clue. :rolleye: Still I'm looking at the bright side... I've spared a lot of mileage on the car not having driven it for the past 5 weeks. :grin:
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I dont understand.. How could there be a 'problem' with the block?
The only problem the block could have is that its overheating or its got a big hole in it.. Its neither of those surely? lol..
Did he say any more?
I hope you're right Jonny and I hope it isn't the block. Obviously the next thing is the leak test but to me the engine block is a black box in that I have no idea what it looks like internally or how it works.
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I dont understand.. How could there be a 'problem' with the block?
The only problem the block could have is that its overheating or its got a big hole in it.. Its neither of those surely? lol..
Did he say any more?
I hope you're right Jonny and I hope it isn't the block. Obviously the next thing is the leak test but to me the engine block is a black box in that I have no idea what it looks like internally or how it works.
A leak down test would show problems with the piston rings potentially, but the block is a block.. Its either working or, it really isnt..
Hope it goes ok mate! Need to have you at the next RWYB day.. No one else is getting close :wink: :wink: hehe..
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Can the Piston Rings be replaced separately? :rolleye:
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There best next stage would be to remove the cylinder head and check the piston crowns for detonation.Sounds like a melt down on the engine mechanicals.How did your stage 2 + Remap? all gone wrong since that point ?
Sad news nadeem. Hope its not as serious as it sounds.
Good luck.
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blimey, so its time to take the head/block apart! Yikes.
feel for ya mate. Soo many K04 engines out there running your set up with no probs. Very very unlucky.
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Guys,
I’ve just seen this and need to correct a few things quickly.
We don’t think that the actual engine block itself is defective as there is nothing to suggest this, some confusion here as I merely said that as we have basically tried many routes without any success, an engine leak down test is going to be performed as the next step to see if anything appears abnormal in the combustion chamber. Until the results of the leak down test are taken, analyzed and if need be compared with other engines there is no need or suggestion to need to remove the cylinder head....
I have not been able to get onto the car recently, as we have some members of staff away in our office, so I am assisting with some office duties until they return….
I can appreciate that there is a lot of interest in this cars fault, This is certainly the highest profile fault that I have worked on. We have spent many hours in and out of the workshop (a scary amount to be honest) looking into this fault and trying to comprehend a series of events that could cause this issue to occur.
I have consulted with Tuning and Software companies from both the UK and USA. A certain high profile USA company whom I cannot name, has seen a similar fault but never truly got to the bottom of the issue and this was with a large development team at their disposal. Their solution was far from ideal.
I certainly feel that we now have arguably the biggest correlation of data for ED30 / K04 spec engines in stage 1 and 2 level of tune. Data logging, Dyno Runs and Oscilloscope waveform patterns of various ECU channels, signals, Actuators and sensors etc – all areas are looking correct though which is the headache! Obviously apart from the AFR lean running issue.
I will be trying to write another report shortly for my customer, to explain things in more detail as it is very time consuming to do so for each and every step / test…..
Regards
JKM
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^^^^
Burning the midnight oil!! You guys continue to impress me with your caring and commitment and that's not even mentioning your knowledge.
I never have any hesitation whatsoever in driving the 2 hour journey each way to JKM.
:happy2:
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I think your attitude, commitment and perseverance in this situation has been exemplary JKM. :happy2:
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^^^2nd that. By far :happy2:.
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Guys,
I’ve just seen this and need to correct a few things quickly.
We don’t think that the actual engine block itself is defective as there is nothing to suggest this, some confusion here as I merely said that as we have basically tried many routes without any success, an engine leak down test is going to be performed as the next step to see if anything appears abnormal in the combustion chamber. Until the results of the leak down test are taken, analyzed and if need be compared with other engines there is no need or suggestion to need to remove the cylinder head....
I have not been able to get onto the car recently, as we have some members of staff away in our office, so I am assisting with some office duties until they return….
I can appreciate that there is a lot of interest in this cars fault, This is certainly the highest profile fault that I have worked on. We have spent many hours in and out of the workshop (a scary amount to be honest) looking into this fault and trying to comprehend a series of events that could cause this issue to occur.
I have consulted with Tuning and Software companies from both the UK and USA. A certain high profile USA company whom I cannot name, has seen a similar fault but never truly got to the bottom of the issue and this was with a large development team at their disposal. Their solution was far from ideal.
I certainly feel that we now have arguably the biggest correlation of data for ED30 / K04 spec engines in stage 1 and 2 level of tune. Data logging, Dyno Runs and Oscilloscope waveform patterns of various ECU channels, signals, Actuators and sensors etc – all areas are looking correct though which is the headache! Obviously apart from the AFR lean running issue.
I will be trying to write another report shortly for my customer, to explain things in more detail as it is very time consuming to do so for each and every step / test…..
Regards
JKM
I hope that you didn't feel you had to write that due to my comments etc.. It seems you are exploring all of the potential avenues with the car. Hope that you find the problem soon and thanks for the comment
Jonny
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Guys,
I’ve just seen this and need to correct a few things quickly.
We don’t think that the actual engine block itself is defective as there is nothing to suggest this, some confusion here as I merely said that as we have basically tried many routes without any success, an engine leak down test is going to be performed as the next step to see if anything appears abnormal in the combustion chamber. Until the results of the leak down test are taken, analyzed and if need be compared with other engines there is no need or suggestion to need to remove the cylinder head....
I have not been able to get onto the car recently, as we have some members of staff away in our office, so I am assisting with some office duties until they return….
I can appreciate that there is a lot of interest in this cars fault, This is certainly the highest profile fault that I have worked on. We have spent many hours in and out of the workshop (a scary amount to be honest) looking into this fault and trying to comprehend a series of events that could cause this issue to occur.
I have consulted with Tuning and Software companies from both the UK and USA. A certain high profile USA company whom I cannot name, has seen a similar fault but never truly got to the bottom of the issue and this was with a large development team at their disposal. Their solution was far from ideal.
I certainly feel that we now have arguably the biggest correlation of data for ED30 / K04 spec engines in stage 1 and 2 level of tune. Data logging, Dyno Runs and Oscilloscope waveform patterns of various ECU channels, signals, Actuators and sensors etc – all areas are looking correct though which is the headache! Obviously apart from the AFR lean running issue.
I will be trying to write another report shortly for my customer, to explain things in more detail as it is very time consuming to do so for each and every step / test…..
Regards
JKM
The part in bold worries me :signLOL: :signLOL: :signLOL:
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Guys,
I’ve just seen this and need to correct a few things quickly.
We don’t think that the actual engine block itself is defective as there is nothing to suggest this, some confusion here as I merely said that as we have basically tried many routes without any success, an engine leak down test is going to be performed as the next step to see if anything appears abnormal in the combustion chamber. Until the results of the leak down test are taken, analyzed and if need be compared with other engines there is no need or suggestion to need to remove the cylinder head....
Sorry, thats right. Its me being pessimistic and thinking the worst. I was looking at the problem from my limited knowledge.
I can appreciate that there is a lot of interest in this cars fault, This is certainly the highest profile fault that I have worked on.
Keith you're a celebrity now :laugh: You'ill have autograph hunters after you at Shows.. :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin:
I certainly feel that we now have arguably the biggest correlation of data for ED30 / K04 spec engines in stage 1 and 2 level of tune. Data logging, Dyno Runs and Oscilloscope waveform patterns of various ECU channels, signals, Actuators and sensors etc – all areas are looking correct though which is the headache! Obviously apart from the AFR lean running issue.
Thats whats so frustrating, worrying and baffling all at the same time... I'm almost wishing that the engine leak test shows up something - anything - that might solve the issue even though it might be a nasty fault :scared:
I will be trying to write another report shortly for my customer, to explain things in more detail as it is very time consuming to do so for each and every step / test…..
Thanks Keith... you've been very thorough and professional. :happy2:
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There best next stage would be to remove the cylinder head and check the piston crowns for detonation.Sounds like a melt down on the engine mechanicals.How did your stage 2 + Remap? all gone wrong since that point ?
Sad news nadeem. Hope its not as serious as it sounds.
Good luck.
No, this fault appeared a day before the Stage 2+ remap.. maybe in anticipation :grin: :grin: I'm getting to the stage where I don't care what the problem is - I just want to know what it is so it can be fixed!
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It's is getting more like war and peace every time I look at your thread Illyun :laugh:
I can't believe that this hasn't been rectified yet. I do understand certain diagnostics need to be carried out in a certain order (certainly no disrespect to JKM who are doing a stirling job :happy2:), however it must be getting to the stage where it would be cheaper to swap a new engine in :confused:
I too noticed the comment "We have spent many hours in and out of the workshop (a scary amount to be honest)" and if you are paying by the hour it would be getting to the point where I'd be asking about labour costs.
I really really hope you bottom this fault out ....if only for the sake of your own sanity :rolleye:
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God. I hope i dont have a similar issue. Boost issues an all that
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Hi Nadeem, :smiley:
Any updates?
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I haven't rang JKM this week... but I reckon no news is bad news in my case :rolleye:
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I was over there this week and the car is still there and looking very nice. :happy2:
I'm sure Jim and Keith will have it sorted soon, they appear to have put a hell of a lot of effort in so far.
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I haven't rang JKM this week... but I reckon no news is bad news in my case :rolleye:
man this thread is unbeliveable, hope u get that sh*t sorted.. is she still under warranty? all the best dude! :happy2:
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I haven't rang JKM this week... but I reckon no news is bad news in my case :rolleye:
man this thread is unbeliveable, hope u get that sh*t sorted.. is she still under warranty? all the best dude! :happy2:
VW Main Dealer Warranty doesn't mean much when you've boosted the power to around 350bhp :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: I accepted that when I embarked down the slippery slope :wink: Don't let that put you off modding though as this is a rare case and its my luck that I get stuff like this happening to me :rolleye:
But JKM have been sterling in their efforts and I don't doubt that they will get to the bottom of this at some point. :happy2:
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I haven't rang JKM this week... but I reckon no news is bad news in my case :rolleye:
man this thread is unbeliveable, hope u get that sh*t sorted.. is she still under warranty? all the best dude! :happy2:
VW Main Dealer Warranty doesn't mean much when you've boosted the power to around 350bhp :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: I accepted that when I embarked down the slippery slope :wink: Don't let that put you off modding though as this is a rare case and its my luck that I get stuff like this happening to me :rolleye:
But JKM have been sterling in their efforts and I don't doubt that they will get to the bottom of this at some point. :happy2:
I was meaning that if it turns out to be very pricy to fix this issue (bottom end related or whatever) couldnt you put it all back to stock and take her in?
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They would be able to tell from the ecu, that she's been mapped,and there goes the warranty unfortunatly.
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I was meaning that if it turns out to be very pricy to fix this issue (bottom end related or whatever) couldnt you put it all back to stock and take her in?
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
I like your suggestion... my local dealer knows me and my cars very well. They know what I have done to it and while I have a good relationship with them and while they might even agree to do a repair if the buck stopped with them it wouldn't happen. Thats because I am sure that VW would want to see the affected parts or whatever especially if it was an unusual or rare fault - simply for their R&D - and the local dealer would certainly have their claim for payment rejected when VW found out that the car was running power way beyond stock. Plus I would not want to come across as dishonest with my local dealer as it might affect their judgement in matters in the future.
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Have you thought of asking VW to get involved, purely as a research excersise?
Send them all the data, along with a full report and see if they can offer any ideas - you'd be surprised how keen they can be to solve a quirky one, just out of curiosity alone. I know Bentley have pulled in 10 year old cars before now when something unheard of has gone pear shaped, engineers can't help themselves.
Good luck.
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Thats a good idea Tony as I am a network engineer and I know there are people who I work with who are sad like that :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: Only problem is contacting the right person/department. I suspect any request probably would not get past the bureacracy although its worth a try :happy2: Maybe the best thing to do would be to contact my local dealer in the first instance and ask them how to go about it :wink:
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Ditto, and I'm one of the saddos - nothing better than getting your teeth into a strange fault, even if it's not our issue.
If you've got a good relationship with the dealer, start there. The fella that looks after my car is ex-VAG and did all the training over in Germany, he knows a few people still in that sort of job, so I can ask if he knows a route too.
Good old scattergun approach!
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Thanks Tony :happy2:
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....
Illyun, check if Mark at VWR can give you any clues who to talk to.
:happy2:
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Any joy Nadeem?
:confused:
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Nadeem - try giving Reuben a ring at Tuningwerkes - 0208 681 0208.
I know that JKM have got so much knowledge on the history of your car, but perhaps another experienced viewpoint may shed some light into the matter. Reuben certainly has over 30 years of knowledge of VAG cars, and I would rate him as good as JKM.
Just a thought :smiley:
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The car is back now guys - sorry for the lack of replies to this thread but I have been so busy this month that I haven't logged on for a while. I am waiting for Keith from JKM to send an update into what happened. The car is running fine now, but its on Stage 2 Revo and not Stage 2+... I am going to leave it like that until the Autumn and change over to APR software who I feel a lot more comfortable with after my experience.
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The car is back now guys - sorry for the lack of replies to this thread but I have been so busy this month that I haven't logged on for a while. I am waiting for Keith from JKM to send an update into what happened. The car is running fine now, but its on Stage 2 Revo and not Stage 2+... I am going to leave it like that until the Autumn and change over to APR software who I feel a lot more comfortable with after my experience.
u are not happy with revo customer service are u ? but i bet its good to have it back ?
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well at least its back and you can enjoy it again :happy2:
give it a while then see what path you want to take from there :driver:
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Nice to hear your car is back. :happy2:
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Well, I suppose it is partially good news Nadeem :smiley:
I gather there was no joy with finding out why REVO stage 2+ gave you lean fuel issues?
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I am mid way through writing a report up on this fault so that all those interested can see what was at the route of the evil and to explain why this has taken so long to find...
I am aiming to get this report completed this week and we are very busy at the moment so I am fitting it in between jobs. I will be sending it onto my customer first. Keith :smiley:
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I am mid way through writing a report up on this fault so that all those interested can see what was at the route of the evil and to explain why this has taken so long to find...
I am aiming to get this report completed this week and we are very busy at the moment so I am fitting it in between jobs. I will be sending it onto my customer first. Keith :smiley:
credit to you and JKM for sticking with it and finally finding out the fault.
your customer service i have to say is top notch! :happy2:
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I am mid way through writing a report up on this fault so that all those interested can see what was at the route of the evil and to explain why this has taken so long to find...
I am aiming to get this report completed this week and we are very busy at the moment so I am fitting it in between jobs. I will be sending it onto my customer first. Keith :smiley:
Nice one Keith, look foward to hearing the outcome.Bet its nice to have part of your workshop place free'd up :wink:.
Good news she's home Nadeem :happy2:
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Well, I suppose it is partially good news Nadeem :smiley:
I gather there was no joy with finding out why REVO stage 2+ gave you lean fuel issues?
Well from what I understand, it may or may not have been the Revo software... it could have been a fuel pressure sensor wrongly fitted to my car by VW at Wolfsburg :surprised: The main reason I am going to go for APR is because of the utter lack of interest shown by Revo in this case - I was given the cold shoulder as soon as I phoned Karl at Revo in early March when they didn't even have any proper information on the issue to make an informed decision about what the problem could be. Unfortunately, it didn't get any better... the attitude seems to be consistent with what R32 owners experienced in this thread - http://www.r32oc.com/performance-technical/1550-revo-stage2-anyone-else-had-issues.html (http://www.r32oc.com/performance-technical/1550-revo-stage2-anyone-else-had-issues.html)... the second post says it all really :fighting: At least their logic was consistent - 'its not the software, its the car' repeated like a well worn mantra... from the start even before they knew what was going on :rolleye: To be honest, I was shocked, not just at the response, but also at the attitude which was blatantly disinterested - I spoke to Karl at the time - in stark contrast to the 'advice' offered when anyone asks him about spending money with Revo. :fighting: Anyway, while many cars run their software with no problems, God help anyone who experiences any issues, as Revo just don't want to know and thats why I have lost faith in them, whether or not the software was at fault.
I have to stress that at no point did JKM try and escape the issue at hand by pointing at other vendors like Revo and indeed, Keith was at pains to protect Revos reputation by always pointing towards other possible causes. However, I'm not a mug and can see that the questions I asked him about the Revo software were not being answered by Revo satisfactorily. All avenues were thoroughly and exhaustively explored as you all know. I finally cornered Kevin at Inters (Revo Sales and Marketing Manager I think) and while he said all the right things, I felt that I was subject to a damage limitation exercise as most of what was offered could have been done so from the start or at least when they were asked to co-operate. I dare not put Stage 2+ back on the car, as I am sure that Revo will revert back to the same mantra and deny all responsibility if anything goes awry. I just feel safer in APRs hands after reading about the support they gave Awesome GTI when John-O's GTI went in with similar issues and after reading about their history as a very thorough and established tuner.
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well good luck with the APR software nadeem.
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....
I'm very glad indeed to read that your car is now running fine, Nadeem.
Hats off to JKM for sticking with it - Lots of people would have given up.
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I agree 100% Robin. JKM have been top notch and I cannot praise them enough. They were honest and clear from the start and even took the trouble to write up everything they did and allowed it to be posted on the net for the whole world to see. :grin: While I know that there are other excellent tuners out there, I'll only use JKM as long as it is run by the same people as I trust them 100%.
BTW, thanks for introducing them to me :happy2:
Edit: Of course, I'll be going to VWR too for tasty mods now and again... plus a free ride in their beast is too hard to turn down. :evilgrin: :evilgrin:
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well good luck with the APR software nadeem.
Thanks mate... The car is running 320bhp at the moment, which is a shame as I really wanted to get as close as possible to JonnyCs times (although lets face it, I don't think his times will be beaten for a long time to come) but this season is over for me as regards to seriously trying and getting good figures at Santa Pod. I'm going to run the car for a couple of months and then see about putting the APR software on... Of course, Revo are welcome to try and win me round, but I doubt they're bothered about a single (angry) customer.... :fighting:
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Mate, it's crap you've had issues with Revo. JKM sound like they did all they could, which is far more than you could ask of any garage.
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hang on a second....
I have tried as much as i can to help yourself and JKM find the fault with your car, there's only so much i can do over the phone...
the fact that your car was running exactly the same software as jonnyc's, steve p's, hurdy's, dom t's and many more! Would indicate that there's nothing wrong with the software and the tuning...... it would CLEARLEY indicate there's a fault with the hardware on the car.
the fact that it has taken someone a lot of time and effort to find the fault is not a reflection on REVO or a reflection on myself, I think everyone knows that our product works and works really well! I don't know what you wanted me to do, every time i have spoken to you or seen you i have given you all the time in the world as i do with all our customers.
I'm sorry you've had an issue with your car but simply pointing the finger that is proven to not be the issue isn't exactly fair now is it!
All the best in whatever you decide for the future of your car mate!
Carl
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Thanks for the comment Karl... its a shame you guys weren't as quick to respond when help was needed... I have had 4 months of experience to reach this conclusion and did not post my comments lightly. Anyway, its not only me who has come across the same customer relations problem with you as the R32 thread clearly shows. I can't fault your enthusiasm when you want to sell your software and I certainly agree that you have always answered questions regarding the application of your software. I also agree that you can only provide limited support over the phone, but it sort of proves the point as the issue should have been forwarded to someone who could actually answer the questions asked, assuming you do have engineers behind the scene.
As for the car's you have mentioned, you are being a bit clever there because as far as I am aware, only JonnyC's car had Stage 2+ software when the issue was initially reported at the beginning of March and most of those guys have had Stage 2+ installed very recently. Also, I thought Hurdy is running Custom Code software?! Besides, I don't think anyone of those cars have had their AFR values checked, although I hope for their sakes that there cars are running fine as I wouldn't wish my experience with the car on anyone else. There were clear and very good reasons why questions were asked of Revo during the diagnostic process that I don't want to go into at length here. All I am saying is that your muted and uncooperative response was in stark contrast to the enthusiastic sales pitch.
For the record, I would again like to explicitly make clear that the fault may NOT have been with the Revo Software but we will never know 100%. Carl, you are also being a bit disingenious when you say that he fault was hardware based as the fault occurred AFTER applying the Revo Stage 2+ software! By that logic, it could well have been the Revo Stage 2+ and its interaction with other mods or hardware on the car that could have caused the issue. I fail to see how this could not be of benefit to you guys. I even asked you in my initial phone call in March whether you had a test car and if that was running ok and you did not test it before release - hardly confidence inspiring. Even then, it was only after exhaustive diagnostics that virtually ruled everything else out that you guys were asked to take a closer look again which you failed to do.
Any early adopter of new technology understands that there are risks associated with using it and I had Stage 2+ installed (along with all the mods that I do) with the understanding that things indeed could go wrong. I am prepared for that and accept it as part of the package when going down the modding route. However, what I also assumed was that Revo would be there to provide answers to questions and an APPROPRIATE level of support and reassurance should this be required post-installed and this was not the case. Take a look at the JohnO problem thread when APR were there to help sort out any issues that occurred.
All said and done, I would not be writing all this if Revo had provided adequate answers to questions posed and shown WHY their software was not at fault instead of just stating it. I kept of from writing anything that could possibly damage Revo's reputation until everything was done and dusted as I did not want to be hasty in what I wrote, but the consistent dismissal by Revo had to be brought to the attention of anyone who might want to go with you. I can say with certainty, that at the moment, I don't trust Revo enough to even take my car down to Daventry, have them apply the software as I know that I'll be left on my own if anything goes wrong. All I can say is that my experience with Revo made me lose confidence in their ability to provide support if anything does go wrong and your reply doesn't inspire confidence either.
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I'm sorry you've had an issue with your car but simply pointing the finger that is proven to not be the issue isn't exactly fair now is it!
Carl
Erm... and how did you reach that conclusion?
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....
I'm hoping that this subject can remain a calm discussion (even if views are strongly stated) and not develop into flaming which the Moderators are then obliged to shut down. That way, we can all benefit from learning where the issues are.
So far so good!
Let's wait and see what Keith's report has to say.
8)
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....
I'm hoping that this subject can remain a calm discussion (even if views are strongly stated) and not develop into flaming which the Moderators are then obliged to shut down. That way, we can all benefit from learning where the issues are.
So far so good!
Let's wait and see what Keith's report has to say.
8)
Hi Robin... I'm calm (breathes deeply :grin:). I hope I don't come across as rude or anything like that, but I simply had to state the facts as I saw them... I think my post was ok but if there is anything anyone would like to point out then I'll certainly take a look and amend it if required :happy2: However, I do know what you mean and the discussion can degenerate into a slanging match which I have no intention in doing. I've said what i had to and I will leave it at that :innocent:
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:grouphug:
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Look forward to reading the report from JKM..
As Carl says I have had stage 2+ on my car for a long time now with no issues.. And sofware is software..
Anyways, glad you have the car back mate, now you can enjoy it again!
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BTW, I am now in possession of the 8 page report by JKM - they really went overboard to help out - and I'll see about putting it online. To those of you who cannot trawl through 8 pages - I certainly haven't yet - I think that the conclusion is that the car is fixed, but is on Stage 2 Revo software. The finger of suspicion is pointing towards the wrong type of fuel pressure sensor fitted at the time of build in Wolfsberg and VW have been handed reams of data by JKM and are investigating. However, the cause is not know with 100% certainty, but it certainly looks the best candidate out of other possible causes.
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If your happy for the report to be fully public you can send it to me for hosting on the site :happy2:
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If your happy for the report to be fully public you can send it to me for hosting on the site :happy2:
pm sent :happy2:
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Don't know if this is of any use - but I had a fuel pressure sensor replaced on recall a few weeks ago, again wrong one fitted.
I'll try finding the recall code.
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Nadeem,
I'm glad you've finally got your car back, working correctly. Just to answer some of your points;
We have Edition 30's running Stage2+ software in numerous regions around the world that have been for a long, long time now. This software was tested prior to release on numerous different cars, I believe at the time you had it on your car there was only Jonny running it in the UK market.
I have a copy of JKM's report on your car. The long and short of this is your car has at some point had an incorrect sensor fitted to it, this is the cause of the problems. Stage2+ software utilises the potential from installing a high pressure fuel pump, up until the point you had Stage2+ installed the problem could have gone unnoticed as the car wouldn't have been running at as higher fuel pressure.
We have always known there is no issue with our software on the car. Since your problems appeared we have been in communication with JKM giving them any further information we could to help solve the issue. We've gone out of our way to help them rule out components/software by way of assessing maps we already knew to be 100% fine, going through both their and NMS logfiles to confirm the correct files have been used, and offering any ideas we had to them. At no point have we
We build our software to suit a certain specification, your car had been altered (by whom we don't know) from this and that was the cause of the problems. If we had made a mistake it would have been evident on every single Stage2+ car that runs our software. This isn't the case and so you're aware fuel pressure has been checked on more than just your car. As per the report your car (for some reason) had an incorrect sensor on it.
We are a software development company, not a diagnostic service. To be expected to diagnose an issue that's not related to our software without even seeing the car is completely un-reasonable. We can only do so much by offering advice and ideas to our dealers and customers in a scenario like this when there is an issue with a component on the car.
I've spoken with trade parts and they do list the incorrect sensor for the ED30. Now your problem has been diagnosed I would advise having your stage2+ re-installed which will allow you to get out there and enjoy the full potential of your car!
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For those who are interested heres a link for the JKM report: -
Click Here to Open in a new Window (http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/downloads/illyun2.pdf)
[pdf]http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/downloads/illyun2.pdf[/pdf]
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Nadeem,
I'm glad you've finally got your car back, working correctly. Just to answer some of your points;
We have Edition 30's running Stage2+ software in numerous regions around the world that have been for a long, long time now. This software was tested prior to release on numerous different cars, I believe at the time you had it on your car there was only Jonny running it in the UK market.
I have a copy of JKM's report on your car. The long and short of this is your car has at some point had an incorrect sensor fitted to it, this is the cause of the problems. Stage2+ software utilises the potential from installing a high pressure fuel pump, up until the point you had Stage2+ installed the problem could have gone unnoticed as the car wouldn't have been running at as higher fuel pressure.
We have always known there is no issue with our software on the car. Since your problems appeared we have been in communication with JKM giving them any further information we could to help solve the issue. We've gone out of our way to help them rule out components/software by way of assessing maps we already knew to be 100% fine, going through both their and NMS logfiles to confirm the correct files have been used, and offering any ideas we had to them. At no point have we
We build our software to suit a certain specification, your car had been altered (by whom we don't know) from this and that was the cause of the problems. If we had made a mistake it would have been evident on every single Stage2+ car that runs our software. This isn't the case and so you're aware fuel pressure has been checked on more than just your car. As per the report your car (for some reason) had an incorrect sensor on it.
We are a software development company, not a diagnostic service. To be expected to diagnose an issue that's not related to our software without even seeing the car is completely un-reasonable. We can only do so much by offering advice and ideas to our dealers and customers in a scenario like this when there is an issue with a component on the car.
I've spoken with trade parts and they do list the incorrect sensor for the ED30. Now your problem has been diagnosed I would advise having your stage2+ re-installed which will allow you to get out there and enjoy the full potential of your car!
Hi Kev,
Thanks for your post... I don't want to repeat what I have written and thanks for your advice ( or is that an offer to come to Daventry?) about having Stage 2+ reinstalled, but I am going to wait for VW to report back on their findings regarding the fuel pressure sensor to be 100% sure as I don't want a repeat experience... and Keith/JKM might close their doors on the sight of my car approaching again with the same issue :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: It seems bizarre that a part can be fitted wrong from factory but no doubt it can happen as I have personal experience of incorrect parts listed 'correctly' on ETKA when doing my S3 I/C install. As for you guys seeing the car, I had to go to JKM first as they are your dealers and I'm sure you don't want anyone with a problem knocking on your door in the first instance!
Regards,
Nadeem
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Hi Robin... I'm calm (breathes deeply :grin:). I hope I don't come across as rude or anything like that, but I simply had to state the facts as I saw them... I think my post was ok but if there is anything anyone would like to point out then I'll certainly take a look and amend it if required :happy2: However, I do know what you mean and the discussion can degenerate into a slanging match which I have no intention in doing. I've said what i had to and I will leave it at that :innocent:
....Nothing rude whatsoever, mate - No problems - I was just spontaneously pre-empting the possibility of a degeneration - We're all human and need to vent our spleens occasionally and I wanted to make sure we got to see Keith's outstanding report.
Absolutely stunningly informative and objective report from Keith! I wonder how VW will respond to the information! I hope they don't just dismiss it as 'you modded the car and so it's not our concern'.
Soooo very glad it's now working out for you, Nadeem :happy2: :jumpmove:
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A fantastic read! Can I just go on the record and say that it is this type service; people being prepared to spend time and show commitment in supporting their customers by producing reports to this standard/detail that really makes a company. I am sure that Nadeem has thanked Keith and Jim for their support but what you have produced is testimant to the service you provide. It is for this reason that I use JKM and will continue to do so in the future.
I agree. I huge wealth of knowledge has been accumulated over the course of this and because of that I am more than happy to continue using JKM. :happy2:
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WOW :jumpmove:
Thanks illyun for sharing the information freely without bias.
Keith/JKM your attention to detail, persistence and attitude shine out as how it should be done :drinking: , I just wish you were nearer :grin:
The implications and theoretical widespread nature of this issue are :surprised:
1. Why has it never been reported or seen before ? given the number of sensors that have probably been replaced on 'odd' cars?
2. I assume this means that ANY car getting a remap has to be assumed to be running a potential problem (if due to be remapped).
Therefore fuel trim adjustment / AFR has to be checked , and if its way off (-15% trim , x:1 ratio etc) then the sensor part number reviewed?
Most remap companies DONT do a rolling road so would never spot the condition, and i guess if the car isnt driven hard enough it wont show a problem either!
Even VCDS will show ok fuel pressures!
Im assuming the car now never shows the 'above 130 bar spikes' it used to?
Be interesting to see how VW respond.
[MODS : can move this to a discussion thread to keep illyuns original post clutter free ???]
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A fantastic read! Can I just go on the record and say that it is this type service; people being prepared to spend time and show commitment in supporting their customers by producing reports to this standard/detail that really makes a company. I am sure that Nadeem has thanked Keith and Jim for their support but what you have produced is testimant to the service you provide. It is for this reason that I use JKM and will continue to do so in the future.
I agree. I huge wealth of knowledge has been accumulated over the course of this and because of that I am more than happy to continue using JKM. :happy2:
....Ditto! :happy2:
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a very very interesting read.
Great work by JKM.
:happy2:
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A fantastic read! Can I just go on the record and say that it is this type service; people being prepared to spend time and show commitment in supporting their customers by producing reports to this standard/detail that really makes a company. I am sure that Nadeem has thanked Keith and Jim for their support but what you have produced is testimant to the service you provide.
:happy2: pleased to see JKM have sorted it, they will be fighting new customers off with a large stick after this outcome :wink: , ..............wonder how many of us are running round in Ed 30's with an incorrect fuel pressure sensor fitted? :scared:
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Just goes to show every car is different, even if its not supposed to be.
There are many people out there these days who just flash some code on your ecu without any diagnostic or monitoring.
Gone are the days when the tuner would start from scratch adding fuel timing and boost to get the best out of that individual car and its mods with a proper wideband sensor in a proper lambda boss in the exhaust in the proper place (not just a pipe stuffed up the back MOT style. Or using the cars normal lambda probe for afr readings)
And then they would map it on the road as the loads generated by road or track driving are hard to replicate on a set of rollers
Sure a simple re-flash works 98% of the time but when somethings slightly different you get problems like this
JKM seemed really helpfull though and stuck with it, good on them.
Glad to see you are now sorted
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:signLOL: @ your new sig Robin - its hilarious... :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin:
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I have to say that I am quite disappointed at VW because it seems from Tony Danza's post that there is a recall on the fuel pressure sensor and I should have been informed by my local Stealer as I did mention the problem with my Ed30 and discussed it with a Master Tech. I would have thought that my mentioning of fuel pressure issues and lean AFR values would have stirred something in his head - obviously too much to expect.
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I have just got an update from Keith at JKM...
'I hope that all is well. I have seen your posts on the GTI forum and I thought that the attached VW Technical Service Bulletin may be of interest for you.
I am not sure if this was ever officially released for the UK market – there may be an equivalent that I do not have access to.
Regardless of this, the attached Technical Service Bulletin actually refers to the low pressure sensor, where as the issue with your car is on the High Pressure sensor. I did look into all of these ‘potential’ causes prior to submitting our report to VW.'
VW are still looking at the high pressure sensor issue highlighted by JKM. Again, I cannot praise JKM enough.. they've got rid of my car (:grin:) but still show an active interest in following up the issue which just shows their professionalism. :happy2:
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If anyone wants to see the Bulletin, I have passed it onto SteveP who might post it on the forum... alternatively, send me a pm and I can mail it across. :happy2:
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me me
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me me
Done... sent to your hotmail account :happy2:
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thank you!
i will print this off and give it to them so they DO change it!!
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thank you!
i will print this off and give it to them so they DO change it!!
Well, they might tell you it doesn't need doing as the bulletin is a US one... there needs to be an equivalent UK one I think :rolleye:
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Regarding a fuel pressure sensor recall, just phoned my local dealers, who I have a very good relationship with, and they stated that there was a low fuel pressure recall on the AXX engines only ? My service "chap" that I use there is a MK5 enthusiast and has never fobbed me off with any query I have had before - can anyone enlighten me ?
Regards,
Gareth
As a subsiduary point I'm glad Nadeem that JKM got to the bottom of the matter - take my hats off to their persistance and professionalism throughout.
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I will get the TSB posted as soon as I get home :happy2:
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I will get the TSB posted as soon as I get home :happy2:
Thanks Steve, am interested to see this.
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I will get the TSB posted as soon as I get home :happy2:
Thanks Steve... :smiley:
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there was a low fuel pressure recall on the AXX engines only ? Regards,
.
I'm sure a few UK guys with BWA engines have posted on other forums that they have had their sensors replaced under the TSB. :confused:
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this is the first i've heard about it...and i've not had any calls from stealer or vw to say mine needs changing??
maybe it was a dodgy batch??
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Mine's a BWA.
Recall notice was a 24m5 - fuel pressure sensor. I don't know if it was low or high, but they did tell me it was the wrong one fitted from the factory.... so it isn't beyond the realms of possibility that yours is incorrect too.
Further to this, neither the old owner who I know well or I had any notification of the recall. I found out when it was in over the DSG jerking, it came up on the system at the dealers They clearly did something too, as the car is much smoother and they hadn't touched the DSG as it was on the latest software.
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i rang vw, spoke to a sarah who was friendly, she said there have been NO recalls for the ed30, she said she has heard NOTHING about any issues with the car,. she also said she knows a lot about the ed30 because she started working there when it was released.
she did however say there was only 2000 ed30s made, thats not right is it??
anyway i told the vw when i booked my service about this document and quoted the code. so see what happeneds
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i rang vw, spoke to a sarah who was friendly, she said there have been NO recalls for the ed30, she said she has heard NOTHING about any issues with the car,. she also said she knows a lot about the ed30 because she started working there when it was released.
she did however say there was only 2000 ed30s made, thats not right is it??
anyway i told the vw when i booked my service about this document and quoted the code. so see what happeneds
Steve, you experienced what is know in colloquial as 'being fobbed of' or 'told a load of bo110cks' etc... Stealers aren't exactly a fountain of knowledge when it comes to the cars they sell and service unfortunately.
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Personally, I'd ring up VW UK. Knowing how BMW UK used to work...the dealers were useless with stuff like this!
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Mine's a BWA.
Recall notice was a 24m5 - fuel pressure sensor. I don't know if it was low or high, but they did tell me it was the wrong one fitted from the factory.... so it isn't beyond the realms of possibility that yours is incorrect too.
Further to this, neither the old owner who I know well or I had any notification of the recall. I found out when it was in over the DSG jerking, it came up on the system at the dealers They clearly did something too, as the car is much smoother and they hadn't touched the DSG as it was on the latest software.
i think i'll give them a ring tomorrow to see if mine needs doing.
But i've had no probs running stage 1 tho. its been an absolute peach!!
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i did, i rang up VW customer service, not my dealer
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Chungster I had no issues with Stage 1 or 2 but as soon as Stage 2+ was installed the problems began
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i did, i rang up VW customer service, not my dealer
Oh. Fair enough then chap. Its hard really. Maybe get a technician at your dealer to call the VW UK technicians while you are there? That was another way to do it at BMW.
Also, haven't VW outsourced their customer services away from their UK HQ?? I remember hearing this a while ago? :confused: This would undoubtedly affect the quality of response regarding the problem.
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well she was english? lol...
my dealer is sh*t, we'll c how it goes. not booked in til 27th!
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Chungster I had no issues with Stage 1 or 2 but as soon as Stage 2+ was installed the problems began
yeah i know but your ED30 engine is very different to mine / Tony D's, we have the poor man Porsche Boxster equivalent BWA 200ps motor.
So if TonyD's needed doing, mine may well need doing also, altho i'm not going stage 2 with this car! But I'll check anyway.
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well she was english? lol...
Hahaha oh! Perhaps it was Audi then!
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well she was english? lol...
my dealer is sh*t, we'll c how it goes. not booked in til 27th!
my dealer has a lovely receptionist called Louise.....i'll be asking to speak to her first! :grin:
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TSB now available for download: -
Click Here to Open in a new Window (http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/downloads/TSB_for_fuel_pressure.pdf)
[pdf]http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/downloads/TSB_for_fuel_pressure.pdf[/pdf]
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aha that vin range doesn't apply to my car (mine's another 40k further on)
yay!
:drinking:
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Chungster I had no issues with Stage 1 or 2 but as soon as Stage 2+ was installed the problems began
yeah i know but your ED30 engine is very different to mine / Tony D's, we have the poor man Porsche Boxster equivalent BWA 200ps motor.
Sorry, I thought you had an Ed30.. you should be ok then :wink:
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aha that vin range doesn't apply to my car (mine's another 40k further on)
yay!
:drinking:
That's an American bullitin though, so I wouldn't be too quick to rule yours out based on those VIN numbers. Mines a July 06 built car.
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aha that vin range doesn't apply to my car (mine's another 40k further on)
yay!
:drinking:
That's an American bullitin though, so I wouldn't be too quick to rule yours out based on those VIN numbers. Mines a July 06 built car.
mine was built 4 months prior to yours. Actually I'm at the stealer on Thurs to test drive a Rocco / GTI back to back so i'll ask them then!
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Quick question Nadeem. Doesn't the APR HPFP come pre fitted with the fuel pressure sensor? I think mine did. Just checked the part number fitted to my pump and it is the revision 'E' part number, not the 'K' that VW says to fit on that TSB. :confused:
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi193.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz267%2Fukdub%2Faprhpfp-2.jpg&hash=674300fb69c6cfac44dfa73035b8e2e5c2afe0b5)
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^^ The one in the TSB is the low presure sensor, Nadeem's issue was with the High Pressure sensor I believe :confused:
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^^ The one in the TSB is the low presure sensor, Nadeem's issue was with the High Pressure sensor I believe :confused:
Me too. :confused:
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the document was with regards to the low presure.
yes his was high, but still a issue with the low one was found in usa
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Ah. Should read more carefully. Where is the high pressure sensor fitted?
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that i do not know :p
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http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=3242.msg94530#msg94530
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http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=3242.msg94530#msg94530
Is the one on the pump not the low pressure one Hedge??
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Is the one on the pump not the low pressure one Hedge??
Can I go 50:50 or phone a friend? :laugh:
Not sure to be honest. It could well be the other one in the pic or it will be on the rail itself. :ashamed:
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I would think it would be the one on the rail as Nadeem had a new APR pump and JKM's report says it was like it from the factory in his car so it's not likely to be the one on the pump :wink:
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Keith did put a picture of one in his report. :smiley:
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Nadeem,
I'm glad you've finally got your car back, working correctly. Just to answer some of your points;
We have Edition 30's running Stage2+ software in numerous regions around the world that have been for a long, long time now. This software was tested prior to release on numerous different cars, I believe at the time you had it on your car there was only Jonny running it in the UK market.
I have a copy of JKM's report on your car. The long and short of this is your car has at some point had an incorrect sensor fitted to it, this is the cause of the problems. Stage2+ software utilises the potential from installing a high pressure fuel pump, up until the point you had Stage2+ installed the problem could have gone unnoticed as the car wouldn't have been running at as higher fuel pressure.
We have always known there is no issue with our software on the car. Since your problems appeared we have been in communication with JKM giving them any further information we could to help solve the issue. We've gone out of our way to help them rule out components/software by way of assessing maps we already knew to be 100% fine, going through both their and NMS logfiles to confirm the correct files have been used, and offering any ideas we had to them. At no point have we
We build our software to suit a certain specification, your car had been altered (by whom we don't know) from this and that was the cause of the problems. If we had made a mistake it would have been evident on every single Stage2+ car that runs our software. This isn't the case and so you're aware fuel pressure has been checked on more than just your car. As per the report your car (for some reason) had an incorrect sensor on it.
We are a software development company, not a diagnostic service. To be expected to diagnose an issue that's not related to our software without even seeing the car is completely un-reasonable. We can only do so much by offering advice and ideas to our dealers and customers in a scenario like this when there is an issue with a component on the car.
I've spoken with trade parts and they do list the incorrect sensor for the ED30. Now your problem has been diagnosed I would advise having your stage2+ re-installed which will allow you to get out there and enjoy the full potential of your car!
Good reply :)
I am thinking my car has this incorrect sensor, does any one have the part numbers for the good and bad sensor?
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I understand VW have revised their parts catalogue after this episode.
Unless it is somewhere in this thread (no I'm not looking for you :P) it might either be worth a call to JKM or a dealer.
Part numbers in here. http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/downloads/illyun2.pdf
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Best to talk to JKM, howvwer Keith is away on his honeymoon at the moment and is away until mid/late December. I do know that mine has the correct part as they compared my car to Nadeems as they had them both there at the same time. I'll trawl through my emails and see if Keith did actually tell me what it was for you.
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Nice one people :congrats:
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I believe it should be part # 06J 906 015B (the incorrectly listed part number that was being fitted from the dealers incorrectly was 06H 906 051A).
Where seen in the past there have been two faults logged as well - 004506 and 008567
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I believe it should be part # 06J 906 015B (the incorrectly listed part number that was being fitted from the dealers incorrectly was 06H 906 051A).
Where seen in the past there have been two faults logged as well - 004506 and 008567
Ok going to check mine tonight :congrats:
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I believe it should be part # 06J 906 015B (the incorrectly listed part number that was being fitted from the dealers incorrectly was 06H 906 051A).
Where seen in the past there have been two faults logged as well - 004506 and 008567
Correct :happy2:
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so if my car has this old sensor i should get the new one and what if that still doesnt solve my flat spot issue? :popcornsoda:
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I just checked mine. The part number i have is 06E 906 051 K and i haven't encountered any lean running issues.....
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I just checked mine. The part number i have is 06E 906 051 K and i haven't encountered any lean running issues.....
do you have revo code or any mods?
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Yes mate. Stage 2+ with all the required bits bar the intercooler. I used to get a missfire at around 6krpm until i fitted the milltek DP which completely solved the issue and its ran sweet as a nut ever since. My cars on a 58 plate just to clarify.
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06E 906 051 K seems to be a later revision than the ones having issues so i think your fine mate..
where are you in the country would be good to compair K1s :) you coming to the rr day?
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I'm in the Midlands. I've not put my name down for any rolling road days yet. Which one is that?
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I'm in the Midlands. I've not put my name down for any rolling road days yet. Which one is that?
next sat 28th - http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=7178.0
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Yes mate. Stage 2+ with all the required bits bar the intercooler. I used to get a missfire at around 6krpm until i fitted the milltek DP which completely solved the issue and its ran sweet as a nut ever since. My cars on a 58 plate just to clarify.
What intake have you got mate? (Sorry if you've posted it and i missed it).
I get the odd misfire at top end and have been wondering if its my Dbilas intake.
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Yes mate. Stage 2+ with all the required bits bar the intercooler. I used to get a missfire at around 6krpm until i fitted the milltek DP which completely solved the issue and its ran sweet as a nut ever since. My cars on a 58 plate just to clarify.
What intake have you got mate? (Sorry if you've posted it and i missed it).
I get the odd misfire at top end and have been wondering if its my Dbilas intake.
I have a Dbilas intake too. I know a few people have mentioned lean issues with the Dbilas, but i modified mine a while back by inserting a custom made 67mm id sleeve inside the maf section. The fuel trims are pretty much bang on now.
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Yes mate. Stage 2+ with all the required bits bar the intercooler. I used to get a missfire at around 6krpm until i fitted the milltek DP which completely solved the issue and its ran sweet as a nut ever since. My cars on a 58 plate just to clarify.
What intake have you got mate? (Sorry if you've posted it and i missed it).
I get the odd misfire at top end and have been wondering if its my Dbilas intake.
I have a Dbilas intake too. I know a few people have mentioned lean issues with the Dbilas, but i modified mine a while back by inserting a custom made 67mm id sleeve inside the maf section. The fuel trims are pretty much bang on now.
Ah good info cheers i'll try it. :happy2:
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^^^^
As I posted recently in another thread: An aftermarket high-flow tubular intake can result in the ECU actioning fuel cuts and this can be further contributed to by running a high boost setting.
But, of course, every car is different, has different mods, and nothing is simple!
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Did Nadeem ever replace the sensor that could of been fitted wrong at the factory, and if so did he go back to stage 2+ ?
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Yes I believe so.
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I'm melted after read that :rolleye: