MK5 Golf GTI
All Things Mk5 => Modifications & Technical Area => Technical Workshop => Topic started by: Hurdy on April 01, 2009, 03:13:19 pm
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Oh FFS!!!! :fighting: :mad:
The Autotech Front drivers side bracket has snapped yet again :sick:
This is now twice in under a year. The first time a replacement pair of brackets were fitted that were thicker than the first, yet one has still broken again.
I don't know what to do now as they both catastrophically snapped at low speed whilst turning a tight corner. I'm basically going to be driving on tenterhooks all the time thinking that one may go again. I daren't take the car on track for fear of a failure at a higher speed and basically want the front ARB back as a stock item or something like an Eibach ARB replacement....at least something I can have more confidence in :scared: :scared: :scared:
Car is once again condemned to the garage until a replacement can be sourced :sad:
Any advice welcome!
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:sad: surely this is something thats well known with them as its now happened twice to you? :(
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Autotech say not!
Last time it went I e-mailed them and they replied saying that they have only had "failures they can count on one hand" out of several hundred sets that they have sold. My answer to this is.....B***ocks. There are postings in the USA about Autotech ARB failures that amount to more than that!! :fighting:
Anyways, I have e-mailed them again and see what they say this time. Autotech aren't cheap and as such I expected a higher quality product, or at least one that didn't snap every 5 months at a cost of time and money to me. I don't know how I'll get this resolved, but I'm damned sure it ain't me who'll be out of pocket at the end of it. :angry015: :angry015: :angry015: :mad: :fighting:
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Sorry to hear this again pal, so do you think the ARB is basically to stiff and the brackets can't cope and there the first thing to give?
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i was just thinking this gaz, weakest link n all.
but to put in an ARB with less torsional rigidity is going to compromise the ride and purpose of an ARB.
surely surely surely autotech cant fob you off with this. it seems like their R&D has been cut short with the mk5 golf!
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Sorry to hear this again pal, so do you think the ARB is basically to stiff and the brackets can't cope and there the first thing to give?
The ARB is a 25mm hollow construction and is purported to be as stiff as a 25mm solid bar with only 70% of the weight. The ARB should be fine, but the brackets (even the newer ones) look like they have been cold pressed into shape with 90 degree angles that are too sharp for the steel and therefore inherently weak at these two points. Both brackets have broken at the same point on the 90 degree bend and both under the same circumstances (very low speed (10mph ish) tight bend). I'm waiting on a call back from JBS to see what they can do for me. Having brackets on a car that are so weak that they can't stand up to normal road use at low speed is a complete joke and as I think about it more, the more p!ssed off I am getting about it.
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but I've never heard of the brackets snapping when using other aftermarket ARB's, Eibachs etc, I've used them for 15k+ plus, so has Joe and countless others, maybe the Autotech ones are stiffer thats what I was thinking :smiley:
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Very sorry to hear this, John - And, yes, it hardly gives you confidence while driving!
As it's happened twice I would insist on full refund of what you paid for them and then use the money towards more reliable ARB's.
If you got them through Awesome or similar, they'll refund you under warranty. Awesome were first rate in the case of my failed Koni FSD's from 2005 with 50k miles on them.
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This isn't good. As you know, I snapped a bracket and was promised the new set are indestructable.. I guess not?
Neuspeed do a 25mm ARB, I wonder if they'll sell the brackets seperately??
However, in the mean time - I think you need a hero?? I've got a spare, so long as you get me another/return it, you're welcome to it.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fe123%2Frobertsm2006%2FP1020586.jpg&hash=9764e233d29968f435510120120efc300336da0c)
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Very sorry to hear this, John - And, yes, it hardly gives you confidence while driving!
As it's happened twice I would insist on full refund of what you paid for them and then use the money towards more reliable ARB's.
If you got them through Awesome or similar, they'll refund you under warranty. Awesome were first rate in the case of my failed Koni FSD's from 2005 with 50k miles on them.
I got mine from JBS and they were great dealing with it last time. Unfortunately I got rid of the stock arbs ages ago thinking I wouldn't need them again :ashamed:
The issue also would be whether or not JBS would do all the replacement work for free as I definitely don't want to be out of pocket!
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The issue also would be whether or not JBS would do all the replacement work for free as I definitely don't want to be out of pocket!
....They certainly should do! They take a responsibility as the supplier and should apply to the manufacturer for their labour reimbursement.
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You've seen my message above/PM, right?
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Thanks for the offer of the bracket TD :happy2:
I'm sticking with trying to get the bracket replaced with either a Neuspeed ARB or an Eibach ARB. In the meantime I'll have to nick the wife's motor.
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Fair enough, let me know if you get anywhere with finding/fitting an alternative - as I'd be interested in having some decent ones too.
Might have a word with my mate's engineering shop and see if something a little stronger can be made up too.
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so are the brackets an autotech item or do the std 1's get used?
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Their own, the standard ones are too small - although can be forced on.
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:happy2:, did wonder
Hurdy, if you need some std ARB's give me a shout, think I've still got the std ED30 1's in the garage roof space
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:surprised:
thats a real bummer John.
I presume no other ARB suffer the same issues?
Without sounding a*sey , I presume they are fitted correctly ?
while reading this im surprised to hear its at low speed , my (limited) knowledge of ARB is that they would be under most stress under higher speed hard cornering. Im presuming not? anyone want to explain what im missing?
Anyway good luck on moving to another make :happy2:
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:happy2:, did wonder
Hurdy, if you need some std ARB's give me a shout, think I've still got the std ED30 1's in the garage roof space
Thanks for the offer Gaz, I'm hoping I don't have to although I'll keep it in mind :happy2:
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:happy2:, did wonder
Hurdy, if you need some std ARB's give me a shout, think I've still got the std ED30 1's in the garage roof space
Thanks for the offer Gaz, I'm hoping I don't have to although I'll keep it in mind :happy2:
Hi John
Did you manage to get sorted?
Sarah
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Yes thankyou,
I've been to JBS today and they had a spare in stock and so it went straight on.
Autotech have also been in contact with me and are shipping over some of their new uprated bracket which are even thicker than before. He says they have had no failures at all with these, so here's hoping :happy2:
Thanks everyone for your replies, they are welcome and appreciated. :smiley:
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Fingers crossed for you John... :happy2:
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Yes thankyou,
I've been to JBS today and they had a spare in stock and so it went straight on.
Autotech have also been in contact with me and are shipping over some of their new uprated bracket which are even thicker than before. He says they have had no failures at all with these, so here's hoping :happy2:
Thanks everyone for your replies, they are welcome and appreciated. :smiley:
That's what they sent me, and they don't look a whole lot different to the first set!! ... to be fair, they've took some abuse so far though and will take some more this weekend.
Fingers crossed, eh!!
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:surprised:
thats a real bummer John.
I presume no other ARB suffer the same issues?
Without sounding a*sey , I presume they are fitted correctly ?
while reading this im surprised to hear its at low speed , my (limited) knowledge of ARB is that they would be under most stress under higher speed hard cornering. Im presuming not? anyone want to explain what im missing?
Anyway good luck on moving to another make :happy2:
An ARB will be under maximum stress when the wheels are at completely different heights, the ARBs job is to keep the wheels relatively flat. It's basically a big stiff bar connecting the wheels, the bigger and stiffer the bar the more stress it puts on the mounting points (where the load is transferred). They look inherently weak with that right angle bend and no support, I'd be tempted to give them to a good engineer to "beef up"
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thanks RunRabbit , I understand the principal its just why it would snap a low speed and not out n about under what I would see as a more stressfull situation
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thanks RunRabbit , I understand the principal its just why it would snap a low speed and not out n about under what I would see as a more stressfull situation
What suspension have you got? How low and stiff is it?
The slow speed cornering - was it on a gradiant or drop curb etc?
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What suspension have you got? How low and stiff is it?
The slow speed cornering - was it on a gradiant or drop curb etc?
Both failures occured at below 15mph whilst turning sharply on the flat (no inclines, declines, off camber etc)
Wheel was turned over 3/4 turn each time.
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Just caught up with this! Very unerving John and I can imagine this niggling at the back of your mind in the future. Maybe a different manufacturer would be best?
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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Same here... I've just seen this thread and have the same feelings as Greenouse - I'd be extremely reluctant to keep the Autotechs on the car out of fear that they may go again, but on the motorway/trackday at high speed :scared:
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Me too! You MUST have confidence in such components. One failure is bad enough but two says you should definitely change.
Just because Autotech say they haven't heard of any other failures doesn't mean there haven't been any and doesn't excuse the two failures.
To me this is a no-brainer - Safety comes first.
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Maybe highlighting the safety aspects isn't the best way to convince him...
John, think of it another way... it might affect your 1/4 mile times as you'ill subconciously be hesitant in applying full throttle 'just in case' :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin: :grin:
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Hmm I was planning on buying these in the near future! Not so sure that I will be now. The specialists that I use keep insisting that the H&R roll bars are by far the best on the market, so I think I'll go for them.
Hope you don't experience another failure John :smiley:
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Thanks everyone for the concern. I'm going to see what these beefier brackets are like before I go chopping them in. I cannot say I'm 100% convinced, but if the brackets look substantially stronger, then they will go on the car, if they look the same then they won't. :happy2:
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Finally the thicker ARB brackets have arrived.....All four of them :happy2:
Especially for Mr Tony Danza, here are a few pics of the broken one next to the new thicker one. You can clearly see the difference in the Guage of the metal bracket compared to the broken one.
Here's hoping that there are no more mishaps from now on.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Ft8%2Fhurdy_album%2FARBBrackets001.jpg&hash=37524ca4b541c004d2c6b88121967f6c4b942c8f)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Ft8%2Fhurdy_album%2FARBBrackets002.jpg&hash=d09bd3ddf43f5b2194fc77502a6782b248937150)
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Thems the new ones!
Same design, but thicker. I've kicked seven bells out of this new set and they're ok so far.... fingers crossed.
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^^^^
tony_danza - Our forum's regular hardcore tester! :happy2:
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^^^^
tony_danza - Our forum's regular hardcore tester! :happy2:
Yes, but I test to destruction too :scared:
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Ahh, it's just occured to me your first replacement set must have been the original thinner ones?
I'm not that concerned about mine now looking forwards.
LOL at Robin, if you saw me driving day to day you'd say the car was wasted on me and take it away. I drive like a granny 99% of the time.