MK5 Golf GTI
General => Random Chat => Topic started by: rdfcpete on December 14, 2011, 08:37:54 pm
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Makes an interesting watch. A good deed, but probably risking problems in today's world:
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the police are investigating a complaint of an assault.
also the guy who was thrown off the train, has posted a video on youtube explaining his side of the story, i will get the link
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Maybe he was genuine - all a bit strange as he didn't seem to plead a structured case to the conductor at the time, from what the filming picked up?
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what he said in the link i posted seems to add up, claims he was given 2 tickets for the same journey instead of one each for the return journey. i agree wth you though, he doesnt seem to explain himself to the conductor very well, but i also dont think the conductor was really interested in what he had to say, he just wanted him off the train.
the "big man" needs to be careful, could land himself up in court for something in which he didnt know the facts so should have kept out of it to be honest, fair enough he might have wanted to get home, but you cant go grabbing people and throwing them to the ground. I would like to have seen how he would have reacted if the kid was a man as big as he was :signLOL:
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the "big man" needs to be careful, could land himself up in court for something in which he didnt know the facts so should have kept out of it to be honest, fair enough he might have wanted to get home, but you cant go grabbing people and throwing them to the ground.
To be honest I think he deserves everything he gets for this, regardless of whether the lad had a ticket or not. It was none of his business and if that lad had fallen badly and hit his head he could have been up on a manslaughter charge.
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Am I right in thinking that the guy is also a fireman, in which case he'll likely be sacked?
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the "big man" needs to be careful, could land himself up in court for something in which he didnt know the facts so should have kept out of it to be honest, fair enough he might have wanted to get home, but you cant go grabbing people and throwing them to the ground.
To be honest I think he deserves everything he gets for this, regardless of whether the lad had a ticket or not. It was none of his business and if that lad had fallen badly and hit his head he could have been up on a manslaughter charge.
Tend to agree with this, basically assault.
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It was on radio 2 yesterday, the lads dad was on and said they have passed it over to the police to deal with..... Sounds like they are going to prosecute the big guy, apparently the lads face is a mess from hitting the floor when they threw him out....
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the "big man" needs to be careful, could land himself up in court for something in which he didnt know the facts so should have kept out of it to be honest, fair enough he might have wanted to get home, but you cant go grabbing people and throwing them to the ground.
To be honest I think he deserves everything he gets for this, regardless of whether the lad had a ticket or not. It was none of his business and if that lad had fallen badly and hit his head he could have been up on a manslaughter charge.
agree, shame for once this lad didnt have a group of mates with him to kick fat boys head in. Hate bullies
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Am I right in thinking that the guy is also a fireman, in which case he'll likely be sacked?
didnt know that he was a fireman, that might explain why the guys wife said he didnt want to make any comment on the matter.
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The boy is from my hometown so it's been on local forums.
Ironically most comments are in support of the Big Man, self policing in Scotland has always been prominent.
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The boy is from my hometown so it's been on local forums.
Ironically most comments are in support of the Big Man, self policing in Scotland has always been prominent.
is the Big Man from the same place too??
i have nothing against self policing, but you have got to be sure you know all the facts what you are acting upon, otherwise you could end up like the big man, possibly in all sorts of trouble
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Someone posted up that the "Big Man" asked the conductor if he wanted him off and the conductor said yes (being an elderley gent and clearly unable to do it himself and with sno support from Transport police), so someone quoted scottish law saying he was given permissiona dn thus acting within the law.
fair play, no ticket no ride and if you then claim later that you noticed the ticket was issued incorrectly on your way, you should have sorted it on arrival when you got there and not "Chanced it" on the way back.
The lads face is a mess?, on facetube he has a small mark on his cheek, lad needs to grow a pair and his parents need to stop thinking compensation for something that was clearly annoying other passengers!!
I dont condone fat lads chucking skinny kids off trains, but the old guy was getting abused and he asked hiu about 20 times to get off and he wa sworn at and ignored, the other passengers clearly wanted him off and to stop delaying them! and the big lad chucked him off, his face only got marked when he threw himself at the big man and he then threw him to floor as 1st time was more a push out the door!
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:congrats:
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point taken, but if you believe you have bought and paid for your ticket your not going to get off the train, i certainly wouldnt. yes the tickets miight have been dup;icated and he might not have realised until he is on the train home.
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point taken, but if you believe you have bought and paid for your ticket your not going to get off the train, i certainly wouldnt. yes the tickets miight have been dup;icated and he might not have realised until he is on the train home.
Exactly, why wasnt he just given a penatly, and allowed to continue his journey? London to edinburgh, is a long way from home
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If he's completely innocent then fair play, certainly didn't deserve a man handling - there's no doubt about that should that be the case.
The thing for me though is that any normal person would've constructed a polite and structured case to the conductor, including the facts and the lads experience. From what I made out from the footage, he's fairly obnoxious and ignorant and doesn't really say much, ignoring the seriousness of the situation initially.
I've been present on a train in a party of around 12 (football crowd admittedly :ashamed: :wink:) where one of the party didn't have a ticket and was legitimately expected to purchase one from the conductor, to continue the journey and avoid a fine. Whether you have a ticket or not, once challenged by the conductor in that situation it always makes a small scene wherever it be on the carriage, how many other passengers there are and whether you expect it or not. In that situation it's always slightly embarrassing when caught out and I certainly wouldn't have reacted like that lad did whether he thought he was in the right or wrong. Communication would've been the key...
It sounds like someone continually says "off" several times at the beginning of the footage. Was that the young lad telling the conductor to "Fu** off"?
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is the Big Man from the same place too??
Apparently the Big Man is from nearby Stirling (12 miles).
This is a local train service, from my understanding he was chucked off at Linlithgow. This either means his next stop was the one he was getting off at for home and in which case could have gone scot-free, or the next stop the other way was Haymarket, where he could do a runner from the station. I'd imagine the conductor stood firm there as he could slip through the net once it got moving.
It's alleged there was a round of applause after he was thrown off - I'd suggest that a lot of petty stropping and abuse had gone on way before the recording started.
If he had a duplicate single ticket as argued, has it been produced yet?? He hardly tried to explain himself in the video and came across as rude.
I used to get the neighbouring train when at uni, and believe me this sort of thing happened a lot.
For an old conductor to stand his ground like that he must have really got his back up, because most turn a blind eye for personal safety.
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point taken, but if you believe you have bought and paid for your ticket your not going to get off the train, i certainly wouldnt. yes the tickets miight have been dup;icated and he might not have realised until he is on the train home.
He states CLEARLY in his youtube reply clip that he saw it on his way to his destination (he CHOSE not to bother sorting it and just chanced it).
If it were most normal peeps they would have fixed it before getting train home again, he chanced it and got thrown off
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point taken, but if you believe you have bought and paid for your ticket your not going to get off the train, i certainly wouldnt. yes the tickets miight have been dup;icated and he might not have realised until he is on the train home.
He states CLEARLY in his youtube reply clip that he saw it on his way to his destination (he CHOSE not to bother sorting it and just chanced it).
If it were most normal peeps they would have fixed it before getting train home again, he chanced it and got thrown off
he certainly would have had an easier journey home if he had sorted it prior to getting on the train., i am in no way sticking up for the kid, i dont know what went on before the video started recording but i just think it could have been handled better by all parties involved. i wouldnt like to see big man prosecuted, i think he now knows not to get involved in them sort of situations without knowing all the facts
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I work on the railway guys, as a Driver on the Hi Speed service in Kent, Luckily i don't have to deal with passengers, but i know the guards get non fare paying passengers a lot, most of them would like to turn a blind eye as they don't get paid enough to get a load of abuse. But they can't at times as the honest fare paying passengers wouldn't be happy if fare dodgers were not dealt with. As for taking personal details 9 times out of 10 they give false details. Believe me i know most would appreciate some help from the general public. Like people have said if he had noticed there was a mix up with his ticket he should have sorted before trying to travel.
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-16288101 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-16288101)
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-16288101 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-16288101)
considering the support the chap has received from the general public (and rightly so) there would be an uproar if he was convicted. at the end of the day, in an ideal world the courts are meant to represent the wishes of the people.
maybe a petition is in order to make it absolutely clear the "Big Man" was acting in the best interests of the other travellers in the absence of the Police. it would be wholly unacceptable to me if he was convicted.
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It might be that his supporters are just being more vocal than the people, myself included, who thought what he did was wrong and completely inappropriate.
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It might be that his supporters are just being more vocal than the people, myself included, who thought what he did was wrong and completely inappropriate.
we'll have to agree to disagree then. i wouldn't think twice about giving a mugger a left hook if i caught him in the act. in essence the "Big Man's" actions were no different. idiots like the fare dodger are one of the reasons train fares are so ridiculously high and they need to be appropriately punished. in my eyes the "Big Man" did nothing wrong.
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Where will it all end though? I'd have completely supported him if it had escalated to violence, but it didn't, and it didn't look like it would have. You simply can't throw someone off a train because it is inconveniencing you, regardless of the circumstances. To describe him as a mugger is wrong too, a mugger is a person who attacks another to rob them. He may (or may not) have been dishonest, but he certainly wasn't attacking the Ticket Inspector.
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Where will it all end though? I'd have completely supported him if it had escalated to violence, but it didn't, and it didn't look like it would have. You simply can't throw someone off a train because it is inconveniencing you, regardless of the circumstances. To describe him as a mugger is wrong too, a mugger is a person who attacks another to rob them. He may (or may not) have been dishonest, but he certainly wasn't attacking the Ticket Inspector.
my point was that if i see someone else breaking the law, as the fare dodger was doing (allegedly), then i'd have no problem sticking up for the innocent party (in this case represented by the ticket inspector). that's all the "Big Man" was doing. and if you've ever hear an obnoxious brat on the train you'll know they are more than an inconvenience :signLOL:
like i said, we'll have to agree to disagree on this point
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Yeah, I completely understand where you're coming from, but I don''t think sticking up for the innocent party needs to mean assaulting them. He was a "Big Man", if he'd asked me to leave, I'd have been out of there! :signLOL:
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I agree with Andrews point of view here, for a random stranger to take it upon themselves to eject the fool from the train was wrong. He was probably frustrated at the delay, from what we can gather the guy did nothing to help himself or exonerate himself from the accusation of not paying the ticket so understandable as his actions were, it was the wrong thing to do. What if the guy had split his head open on the platform? Just deserts for not paying a train ticket? No. And I don't think the 'big-man' was careful enough to mitigate against this. It was more luck than judgement on his part.
Its very small scale but vigilantyism has no place in a civilised society.
The correct thing would have been to get the police to meet the train at the next station.