MK5 Golf GTI
All Things Mk5 => Modifications & Technical Area => Performance Modifications => Topic started by: Alexis on August 12, 2012, 10:05:39 am
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Morning all,
Before I go any further I know that this has been discussed a thousand times before, but I have managed to narrow it down to 2 options and I am new so I can be forgiven for asking the million dollar question :smiley:. My choices the ITM Maxogen & the Forge TWINtake.
So what would people recommend? I will probably go for a remap at some point in the future and also what I'm looking for is the noise i.e induction noise & flutter but only when accelerating. Does that make any sense?
Thanks
Al
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Oem is fine for stage 1/2. If you go 2+, then it's worth going for an intake. ITG is noisier.
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Morning all,
Before I go any further I know that this has been discussed a thousand times before, but I have managed to narrow it down to 2 options and I am new so I can be forgiven for asking the million dollar question :smiley:. My choices the ITM Maxogen & the Forge TWINtake.
So what would people recommend? I will probably go for a remap at some point in the future and also what I'm looking for is the noise i.e induction noise & flutter but only when accelerating. Does that make any sense?
Thanks
You'll deffo see power with an intake even on stock car just make sure it's a cold sealed system that's fitted correctly,
We see loads that are fitted sh*te and pick red hot engine bay air up rather that cool ambient air
We've fitted just about every kind, the open ones are obviously noisier but the new ITG is now closed so quiet really
I don't know how the twintakes get good flow the filters really are tiny IMO
We use VF or Evoms on our big power cars the flow is incredible but they are noisey
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The new enclosed itg. Is this available for k04 cars?
I've tried searching but haven't found anything.
Sent from my iPhone
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Yes it is buddy have a look at my build thread. :jumpmove:
http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,51751.0.html
http://www.volkswagenracing.co.uk/parts/vwr-cold-air-intake-system-12/
Its the best for noise but the fit isn't great which I will update on Tuesday as I have time to play.
If you read carefully I have had ALL the intakes almost so can say with some authority I am most happy with this one.
Avoid at all costs the Forge TwinTake. Before I get lambasted that is my opinion. My car never ran right with it. I took it off it ran great so make your own mind up.
Stage 2+ ED30.
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I must say I've tried a few.
Twintake
Pflow
Bsh
Dblias
Itg
Pipercross
Carbonio.
I get fed up with noise and felt the dblias was the best I've had.
But if itg enclosed one is quiet ish that maybe my answer.
Cheers
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Thanks for all your opinions. I have just won a twintake off ebay, sorry h4rdy it was after I saw your post :surprised:
I'll give it a go and see how it works out. Whilst reading posts on intakes people mention oil catch tanks, are these necessary? Will I need anything else to make the induction kit work to its full potential?
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I must say I've tried a few.
Twintake
Pflow
Bsh
Dblias
Itg
Pipercross
Carbonio.
I get fed up with noise and felt the dblias was the best I've had.
But if itg enclosed one is quiet ish that maybe my answer.
Cheers
I've used Dibilas Lots in the early days but it's a heavy messy thing on the tfsi's makes more power than stock though, again a really tiny filter in there
Mind you the ITG is messy IMO (Although I do run an ITG panel on the 997t as the filter itself has very good flow)
Both these do exactly what's intended
I think the evoms in probably my favourite for looks & doesn't heat soak as much although I don't run that myself as its not big enough on the maf housing
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Thanks for all your opinions. I have just won a twintake off ebay, sorry h4rdy it was after I saw your post :surprised:
I'll give it a go and see how it works out. Whilst reading posts on intakes people mention oil catch tanks, are these necessary? Will I need anything else to make the induction kit work to its full potential?
Software :driver:
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Catch cans are snake oil on a road car.
Stick with the PCV.
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I must say I've tried a few.
Twintake
Pflow
Bsh
Dblias
Itg
Pipercross
Carbonio.
I get fed up with noise and felt the dblias was the best I've had.
But if itg enclosed one is quiet ish that maybe my answer.
Cheers
Ill try and get a video up.
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I must say I've tried a few.
Twintake
Pflow
Bsh
Dblias
Itg
Pipercross
Carbonio.
I get fed up with noise and felt the dblias was the best I've had.
But if itg enclosed one is quiet ish that maybe my answer.
Cheers
Ill try and get a video up.
Good man thanks.
Just one question where did you it?
Sent from my iPhone
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If you meant where did I get it, it was from a forum member with the maxogen part as well.
But VWR, Awesome and APR sell it as well.
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Emailed apr
Thanks
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.
These are the usual considerations which folks make when choosing an aftermarket intake: (Not in order of importance)
- Performance
- Standard of manufacture
- Ease of maintenance
- Sound
- Appearance aka 'Eye-Candy'
- Price
We are all different individuals with our own preferences.
I chose the Forge Twintake and it ticks all the boxes for me on my modified K03 GTI.
Review & Info: http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,9988.0.html
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Catch cans are snake oil on a road car.
Stick with the PCV.
....CatchCan system? - I'm very happy with mine by Forge but wasn't with the BSH. Not sure if I would have bothered if buying now - Forum opinions are very split. But I wouldn't go as far as calling them "snake oil". They REDUCE, not stop, the amount of nasty stuff, even on a performance modified road car, and surely that can't be a bad thing. A good one such as by Forge is expensive though.
Review: http://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,16343.0.html
I think the OEM PCV has been revised - I wonder why? :popcornsoda:
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If you meant where did I get it, it was from a forum member with the maxogen part as well.
But VWR, Awesome and APR sell it as well.
Well don't think I'll be buying one of them.
I wouldn't pay £441 for an intake.
It would need to be gold plated.
Sent from my iPhone
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Well don't think I'll be buying one of them.
I wouldn't pay £441 for an intake.
It would need to be gold plated.
....Just be grateful you don't run a BMW and fancy an aftermarket intake. Prices are all relative and depend on what money you have spare to spend.
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i read somewhere on the forum that the Forge WinTake is due to be released in the UK soon. if US prices are anything to go by they'll be around £100 cheaper than the TwinTake, and considering it's the same piece of kit but without the (most likely pointless*) second intake it should give you exactly the same increased airflow as the TwinTake but cheaper
*i call it pointless as the two intakes still feed into an inlet pipe with a smaller diameter, meaning that the air flow is restricted to that of a single intake at the point of convergence. i'm no expert in flow dynamics, but i'd imagine that the WinTake and TwinTake will have a negligible difference in performance on this basis.
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i read somewhere on the forum that the Forge WinTake is due to be released in the UK soon. if US prices are anything to go by they'll be around £100 cheaper than the TwinTake, and considering it's the same piece of kit but without the (most likely pointless*) second intake it should give you exactly the same increased airflow as the TwinTake but cheaper
*i call it pointless as the two intakes still feed into an inlet pipe with a smaller diameter, meaning that the air flow is restricted to that of a single intake at the point of convergence. i'm no expert in flow dynamics, but i'd imagine that the WinTake and TwinTake will have a negligible difference in performance on this basis.
....As you can no doubt imagine, when news of the Forge Twintake first hit the forums in America where it was also being tested and developed, there were loud and widespread doubts expressed about the side fed pipe and also the air convergence. Forge USA explained all about the airflow and filter surface areas etc and I have included that info in my Review (linked in this thread earlier).
The fact as I understand it is, illogical as it may seem to be to a layman, Forge's tests show that the Twintake delivers more power than the single pipe Wintake. I had long phone chats with Forge about this and they told me then that they had tried a single pipe version and might release it later as a cheaper alternative - This is the Wintake.
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I don't know how the twintakes get good flow the filters really are tiny IMO
....As I understand it, it's all about maximising the air filter surface area (as well as the pipework, maf, etc). Note how comparitively massive the EVOMS cone surface area is. The surface area total of the Twintake's two relatively small filter cones add up to a bigger area than most single cones.
Being enclosed, and hence reducing noise escape, I expect that the new ITG offering has a much smaller filter and surface area than their open Maxogen. So, it ought to deliver less power but I don't know any stats.
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^^^^
Btw, I'd just like to make it clear that although I have worked closely with Forge from time to time and have written a review, I am not trying to persuade everyone that the Forge Twintake is the best intake available out there. I'm just reporting my own satisfaction in the context of my individual car's mods and trying to objectively contribute info and help to this discussion.
As I listed earlier, we each buy an aftermarket intake (or not) to satisfy our own tickboxes. :happy2:
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i read somewhere on the forum that the Forge WinTake is due to be released in the UK soon. if US prices are anything to go by they'll be around £100 cheaper than the TwinTake, and considering it's the same piece of kit but without the (most likely pointless*) second intake it should give you exactly the same increased airflow as the TwinTake but cheaper
*i call it pointless as the two intakes still feed into an inlet pipe with a smaller diameter, meaning that the air flow is restricted to that of a single intake at the point of convergence. i'm no expert in flow dynamics, but i'd imagine that the WinTake and TwinTake will have a negligible difference in performance on this basis.
The fact as I understand it is, illogical as it may seem to be to a layman, Forge's tests show that the Twintake delivers more power than the single pipe Wintake. I had long phone chats with Forge about this and they told me then that they had tried a single pipe version and might release it later as a cheaper alternative - This is the Wintake.
playing devil's advocate for a minute, are these the same Forge tests that show no power loss with the DV spacer? as i'm sure you can appreciate RR it makes sound business sense to sell two identical items but one for £100 more and try and convince the buying public that that extra £100 is worth it as they're somehow getting more.
even if Forge's tests are right, what sort of extra power are we talking? 2-3bhp peak power? i remain cynical tbh.
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playing devil's advocate for a minute, are these the same Forge tests that show no power loss with the DV spacer? as i'm sure you can appreciate RR it makes sound business sense to sell two identical items but one for £100 more and try and convince the buying public that that extra £100 is worth it as they're somehow getting more.
even if Forge's tests are right, what sort of extra power are we talking? 2-3bhp peak power? i remain cynical tbh.
....Nothing wrong in playing Devil's Advocate - In fact it's good for the forum when posts are challenged (if done so politely and without calling each other stupid).
At the time I discussed (in numerous phone calls) the Twintake with Forge there was no intention on their part to offer a single pipe version. The single pipe version at that time was just an additional prototype to see if the more expensive to produce Twintake was the best way forward. Without sufficient gains, Forge said they would not produce it - That applies to most aftermarket performance product manufacturers.
I'm afraid that I don't remember the exact performance comparisons and I don't want to stab at it and get it wrong.
I take your point about Forge's DV spacer but don't know enough about it to comment in depth but suggest that if it is a widespread common problem, why hasn't the product either been withdrawn or modified? Do we know for 100% certain that those reported were properly fitted?
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playing devil's advocate for a minute, are these the same Forge tests that show no power loss with the DV spacer? as i'm sure you can appreciate RR it makes sound business sense to sell two identical items but one for £100 more and try and convince the buying public that that extra £100 is worth it as they're somehow getting more.
even if Forge's tests are right, what sort of extra power are we talking? 2-3bhp peak power? i remain cynical tbh.
....Nothing wrong in playing Devil's Advocate - In fact it's good for the forum when posts are challenged (if done so politely and without calling each other stupid).
At the time I discussed (in numerous phone calls) the Twintake with Forge there was no intention on their part to offer a single pipe version. The single pipe version at that time was just an additional prototype to see if the more expensive to produce Twintake was the best way forward. Without sufficient gains, Forge said they would not produce it - That applies to most aftermarket performance product manufacturers.
I'm afraid that I don't remember the exact performance comparisons and I don't want to stab at it and get it wrong.
I take your point about Forge's DV spacer but don't know enough about it to comment in depth but suggest that if it is a widespread common problem, why hasn't the product either been withdrawn or modified? Do we know for 100% certain that those reported were properly fitted?
i remember one of our resident tuners (tho i can't remember which) mentioning that he'd seen a few cars that were down on power due to the DV spacer. his wording suggested it was the spacer itself, and not fitting issues.
it would be interesting to see back to back dyno tests of the TwinTake and the WinTake on the same car. i'd be shocked if there was a difference, but i've been wrong before...
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If you meant where did I get it, it was from a forum member with the maxogen part as well.
But VWR, Awesome and APR sell it as well.
Well don't think I'll be buying one of them.
I wouldn't pay £441 for an intake.
It would need to be gold plated.
Sent from my iPhone
Yes its expensive but IMHO its the best one yet.