MK5 Golf GTI
All Things Mk5 => How to Guides / Troubleshooting => Topic started by: xxx_mojo_xxx on August 23, 2009, 09:06:38 pm
-
Any recommendations?
-
APR new or rebuilt...
-
i ordered autotech internals from JBS as they supposably had them in stock. 3 weeks on still havent got them. be keen to see a how to guide from someone about doing it
-
There have been supply issues with the autotech for a while now, that's why I went with the KMD which JBS did have in stock and was received next day.
Install instructions can be found here - http://www.autotech.com/instructions/i127100k.pdf
-
mentioned KMD to him, he said not to as they had issues with KMD internals going wrong!!!!
-
^^^ Funny how they change there mind, I only brought mine in June and they said then not to wait for the autotech :laugh: :laugh:
-
Ok, I think I'm in need of a quick run through the advantages of the high pressure fuel pump.
They all seem to be around 500-800 quid. What will this give me performance wise?
Is there a noticeable difference? Any issues/problems I should be aware of?
Thanks
-
AARRRRGGGGHHHHHH I JUST WANT SOME NEW INTERNALS FOR STAGE2+
they are getting a phone call tomorrow. were the KMD internals an easy fit or did you not do it yourself. if the have them in stock i might get a swap done
-
Ok, I think I'm in need of a quick run through the advantages of the high pressure fuel pump.
They all seem to be around 500-800 quid. What will this give me performance wise?
Is there a noticeable difference? Any issues/problems I should be aware of?
Thanks
it'll only be that much if you go for the APR replacment pump.
new internals will set you back 300 queen quids
It will also give you a huuuuggggeeeee amount more torque in the midrange+ more bhp, which is what you want. torque is what makes your car feel fast
-
It a reasonably easy job to do if you have the tools and a very clean working environment.
The only issue on mine was the original o-ring had perished and they don't supply a new one with the kit.
I was in a hurry so had the TT Shop do mine at the same time the 2+ Revo code flashed onto the car the night I was driving down to Folkenstone to travel to the ring :laugh:
-
im gutted its taken so long i never got to do the ring at stage 2+
-
Phone Statllers in Sheffield for the Autotech internals. They had a few left in stock last week and he's ordered another 8 too. :happy2:
http://www.statller.com/
-
very tempted to go down his route before i go ko4
-
you might find its enough. 280BHP, 340Ibft, that'll make for a pretty quick car.I hope thats what i find, Ko4 is soooo much more expensive
-
i will see what pay day brings ! internals sound like a good plan to me . so by adding this will i have to get upgraded to stage 2 + ? im already at stage 2 at the mo and whats the cost of stage 2+ ?
-
an extra £50 if your already at stage 2
-
an extra £50 if your already at stage 2
True but suggest that you also check that the dealer doesn't also want to add in garage time to the overall costing.
-
an extra £50 if your already at stage 2
True but suggest that you also check that the dealer doesn't also want to add in garage time to the overall costing.
A lot will do this now as they like to setup/log the car to make sure everything is running fine :happy2:
-
an extra £50 if your already at stage 2
True but suggest that you also check that the dealer doesn't also want to add in garage time to the overall costing.
A lot will do this now as they like to setup/log the car to make sure everything is running fine :happy2:
....A very good idea to check she's running fine, imho - It could cost you more than an extra few squid otherwise if a problem wasn't discovered and sorted. I'd want a dyno session done anyway.
-
Just be aware with Stage2+ On REVO you may not get what you expect on the Dyno.
For some reason i believe the latest Stage2+ REVO code doesn't like the Dyno and no matter what Timing advance you set (even 9) it will show no timing pull whatsoever. Also the car will not request Maximum boost AT ALL throughout the rev range.
However get it on the Road and it all performs as expected. Assuming you have no problems with the Car to start with it will request 2500+mbar of boost and give it from about 2500rpm to around 4200rpm before starting to slowly tail off. The car will also start to show timing pull (dependent on car) from about 4 upwards.
I spent nearly 2 weeks trying to find a phantom problem with my car only to discover it may be the code :confused:
But to highlight it a bit easier (and not to take the thread too far off topic)
I had Stage 2+ flashed (my car has every conceivable mod for a KO3)
Stage 2 i had 257bhp and 302lb/ft (only CBE though)
Stage 2 + and TBE i got 264.5bhp and 285lb/ft
After 2 weeks and changing a few parts on the car for brand new ones (plus the car engine was stripped cleaned checked rechecked and put back together 4 TIMES looking for boost leaks etc) the car was put back on the Dyno
Result 265bhp and 287lb/ft :mad:
When looking at the logs the car (on the dyno) would not request max boost as it should highest was 2450mbar at 4400rpm which is too late and at 2500rpm it was only asking for 2290mbar
However put the car on the road and the following happened (and consistenly over 30+ logging runs)
At 2500rpm the car would request 2500mbar and give 2560 mbar actual (at some points it gave 2580)
This would be held all the way to 4200 rpm where it would start to slowly tail till at approx 6000rpm it was still holding 2100mbar of boost
So the final result was (after some clever calculations from boost logs etc using VCDS):
On the dyno 265.1bhp and 287lb/ft
On the road 282bhp and 331lb/ft
The calculations were checked against the Dyno results and were found to be accurate (within 0.5bhp and 2lb/ft which i knocked off)
So in reality my car has 282bhp and 331lb/ft but on the Dyno shows 265bhp and 287lb/ft
So if you are getting Stage 2+ dont be disheartened by the results
Use VCDS and the instructions on the Rosstech website and you will get a better answer on what your car has
Oh and for those who asked why you need the pump, You can't have Stage 2+ without it AFAIK as its a Fuel Pump tailored map
HTH
Carl :happy2:
-
interesting , but like you say you should start a proper thread for this.
the car (or code) doesnt 'know' its on the dyno , so whats the factor indicating it is ? (airflow)
be good to know the type of dyno too :happy2:
-
Ah nice one Carl that explains a bit more to me as i've had similar issues on my KO4. Was on the rollers nearly half a day and done our heads in.
-
good news, JBS now have the Pump internals in stock, so if anyone wants some get in there quick.
mine are in the post as we speak :party:
-
I found this years ago with the impreza. Vehicle speed against wind speed is great factor to remember. Fans etc used on the rolling road setup are never controlled to match the vehicle speed on the rollers so you never get the same results as when on the road. There are a few rolling roads out there that match fan/wind speed to vehicle roller speed. Or, i should say were out there. Not looked into this for a long time now.
Iain
-
good news, JBS now have the Pump internals in stock, so if anyone wants some get in there quick.
mine are in the post as we speak :party:
Awesome news!
How much are they knocking them out for Simon?
-
i would advise getting these fitted by a professional or someone who has at least done it before and has a clean environment to work in, unless you are very competent in doing this yourself
although it looks easy as per instructions, its quite an important part your are tampering with and getting dust in it or not fitting properly can no doubt cause issues with your car.
don't want to start a what pump is best argument, but the apr offerings are the only pumps which are tried and tested before been shipped out to you which gives me peace of mind :happy2:
-
good news, JBS now have the Pump internals in stock, so if anyone wants some get in there quick.
mine are in the post as we speak :party:
Awesome news!
How much are they knocking them out for Simon?
£305 plus P7P. Im semi competent plus i share a workshop with a load of mechanics so i can call on help if needed.
-
Did you order it online? It won't let me select it?
-
Did you order it online? It won't let me select it?
Are you afraid to speak to someone on the phone?? :wink:
-
I'm in work and I can't really use the phone in my job. :wink:
I've emailed Mike direct and ordered on thate way.
-
I paid online
-
What's the maximum pressure that these after market fuel pumps can deliver?
-
no idea mate, but its more than enough for what jonnyC is pushing out of his, so i doubt you'll max out these
-
I seem to remember that they are 140bar.
-
The reason I ask is because somewhere I read that the OEM fuel pump dished out 130 bar.
Doesn't seem like much of an improvement to 140 for close to 800 bucks...
-
the oem pump will deliver that higher up the rev range, but not in the mid-range :happy2:
-
plus its more about flow than just pressure...
-
plus its more about flow than just pressure...
As my wife keeps reminding me... :signLOL:
-
plus its more about flow than just pressure...
As my wife keeps reminding me... :signLOL:
:grin: :grin:
-
plus its more about flow than just pressure...
As my wife keeps reminding me... :signLOL:
:grin: :grin:
:grin:
-
As John quite rightly says the pump upgrade is to increase flow/quantity as opposed to pressure. What this does though is enable a greater pressure to be maintained in the fuel rail in the mid rev range by maintaining a higher volume of fuel in the rail.
The OEM fuel rail has a pressure relief which IIRC is maxed at approximately 130Bar.
The issue arises because the pump is being driven directly from the cam which means it is directly related to engine speed. At mid range engine speeds the OEM pump cannot flow enough fuel to feed a modified engine.