MK5 Golf GTI
All Things Mk5 => Mk5 General Area => Topic started by: martziniuk on September 08, 2013, 01:53:48 pm
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Well I tried the intake cleaning white spirit method today.
I used RON ECHT's method as shown in this vid
I took pictures with the borescope before and after. It was hard to get the scope in but I did my best, here are the results:
Before
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fgg24%2Fmartziniuk%2F20130126171535.jpg&hash=688f9c8e130dd12dd3a98705f14ed7f8dd0dc97d)
After
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fgg24%2Fmartziniuk%2F20130908131429.jpg&hash=332d078252eb375f96601448bf29dc59b4a2641a)
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fgg24%2Fmartziniuk%2F20130909193622.jpg&hash=afcdebb01a46c40dc1383e74cf10cd17bc6efff0)
Admitadly I only got one valve but there is clearly a reduction in carbon. On the road the car feels no different so far but at idle the is no more puttt noise as it ticks over.
Like Ron I think I will now be doing this periodically as its very easy to do.
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very good :congrats: does it feel any better?
have you looked at the Italian tune up?
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Doesn't feel any different so far but I took it out after it was heat soaked from the cleaning. I never had any running issues, I just thought I'd try this method.
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very good :congrats: does it feel any better?
have you looked at the Italian tune up?
Annoyingly an Italian tune up doesn't help one bit on the tfsi engines.
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very good :congrats: does it feel any better?
have you looked at the Italian tune up?
Annoyingly an Italian tune up doesn't help one bit on the tfsi engines.
Shame, I wonder why not?
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Why don't you take the inlet off and use some seafoam? More work admittedly but alot better job than doing it that way I think and you know it's right.
I'm gonna do mine soon I reckon!
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Why don't you take the inlet off and use some seafoam? More work admittedly but alot better job than doing it that way I think and you know it's right.
I'm gonna do mine soon I reckon!
I've had my intake off twice already, I'm not taking it off again. The point is the tfsi is always going to clog up, this way keeps it semi clean without the time and expense of removing the inlet manifold.
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very good :congrats: does it feel any better?
have you looked at the Italian tune up?
Annoyingly an Italian tune up doesn't help one bit on the tfsi engines.
Alex what do you think of RON ECHT's method?
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Looks like it shifted a bit of loose build up.
Using Seafoam through the IAT sensor might work from new but I can't see it cleaning those valves.
The Carbon is baked on at high temperature. The only proven method I've seen is cleaning the valves by hand.
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very good :congrats: does it feel any better?
have you looked at the Italian tune up?
Annoyingly an Italian tune up doesn't help one bit on the tfsi engines.
Shame, I wonder why not?
No way of getting the engine hot enough to burn all the carbon away, and it's direct injection so using a fuel additive won't clean the inlet ports.
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Would a good long Journey not make a difference, if i remember correctly, reading about keeping the revs just over 4500 for about 25mins.
That helps clean/remove carbon from the valves.
Now thats just what i remember reading, dont shoot :fighting: me down if I'm wrong...
:popcornsoda:
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Never tried it but this look quick and simple.
Check out this video on YouTube:
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Removing and reinstalling the Manifold is fairly involving.
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Yes, like most jobs - that method above means it will be clean, proper starting point!
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I went out and took a better after photo which is now added to the original post.
I think this is conclusive proof this method works.
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if it feels no different then maybe theres no benefit?
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As far as it feeling different...I too only notice a slight difference because I do this every 10k miles. The difference I do notice is that it is so smooth when you play the throttle at lower rpm's around the slightly open throttle positions. Another difference is there are never any misfires...I also run 12oz through the tank every 5k miles for the injectors and hopefully the exhaust valves....maybe.
One thing I may not have made clear in my sprayer mod vid is the spray pattern you get from the tube you use. I tested my pattern after completing my little pressure sprayer mod...What I did is...I melted the end of the tube, to be used as the spraying end, shut with a cig lighter. I think that I may have even pinched it while still molten so it would be a bit on the flat side when cooled. Then I took a razor blade and cut off just a tiny bit...then I tested the spray pattern looking for a fine mist. I might have cut just a tiny bit two or three times before I got a nice mist pattern to spray under pressure. The reason I did this is that using just a tube, at least from the pressure sprayer and tube I modded to use, only gave a stream pattern when sprayed. Simply thinking about that made me assume that the fluid may not reach all of the intake ports evenly with equal amounts for each cycle of each cylinder. It made sense that lightening, or rather misting, the fluid pattern that more evenly distributed application would be the result. I can make a quick vid to add to my sprayer mod vid if anyone would like me to ;p
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As far as it feeling different...I too only notice a slight difference because I do this every 10k miles. The difference I do notice is that it is so smooth when you play the throttle at lower rpm's around the slightly open throttle positions. Another difference is there are never any misfires...I also run 12oz through the tank every 5k miles for the injectors and hopefully the exhaust valves....maybe.
One thing I may not have made clear in my sprayer mod vid is the spray pattern you get from the tube you use. I tested my pattern after completing my little pressure sprayer mod...What I did is...I melted the end of the tube, to be used as the spraying end, shut with a cig lighter. I think that I may have even pinched it while still molten so it would be a bit on the flat side when cooled. Then I took a razor blade and cut off just a tiny bit...then I tested the spray pattern looking for a fine mist. I might have cut just a tiny bit two or three times before I got a nice mist pattern to spray under pressure. The reason I did this is that using just a tube, at least from the pressure sprayer and tube I modded to use, only gave a stream pattern when sprayed. Simply thinking about that made me assume that the fluid may not reach all of the intake ports evenly with equal amounts for each cycle of each cylinder. It made sense that lightening, or rather misting, the fluid pattern that more evenly distributed application would be the result. I can make a quick vid to add to my sprayer mod vid if anyone would like me to ;p
if you could get a bit more info on the sprayer that would be great. im certainly going too try this.
what fluid is it if you dont mind me asking?
could you use a aerosol powered carb cleaner? maybe more powerful too jet clean?
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I used this garden sprayer
http://www.wilko.com/pressure-washers+pumps/wilko-get-watering-pump-sprayer-2l/invt/0123775?VBMST=Garden%20sprayer
And a piece if black rubber tube I found from an old part. I'm going to try to make a nice spray pattern the next time I do this.
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As far as it feeling different...I too only notice a slight difference because I do this every 10k miles. The difference I do notice is that it is so smooth when you play the throttle at lower rpm's around the slightly open throttle positions. Another difference is there are never any misfires...I also run 12oz through the tank every 5k miles for the injectors and hopefully the exhaust valves....maybe.
One thing I may not have made clear in my sprayer mod vid is the spray pattern you get from the tube you use. I tested my pattern after completing my little pressure sprayer mod...What I did is...I melted the end of the tube, to be used as the spraying end, shut with a cig lighter. I think that I may have even pinched it while still molten so it would be a bit on the flat side when cooled. Then I took a razor blade and cut off just a tiny bit...then I tested the spray pattern looking for a fine mist. I might have cut just a tiny bit two or three times before I got a nice mist pattern to spray under pressure. The reason I did this is that using just a tube, at least from the pressure sprayer and tube I modded to use, only gave a stream pattern when sprayed. Simply thinking about that made me assume that the fluid may not reach all of the intake ports evenly with equal amounts for each cycle of each cylinder. It made sense that lightening, or rather misting, the fluid pattern that more evenly distributed application would be the result. I can make a quick vid to add to my sprayer mod vid if anyone would like me to ;p
if you could get a bit more info on the sprayer that would be great. im certainly going too try this.
what fluid is it if you dont mind me asking?
could you use a aerosol powered carb cleaner? maybe more powerful too jet clean?
Carb cleaner would evap too quickly as it is designed to do so...I used mineral spirits or rather white spirits in the UK. I will redo my vid and show more detail of the mod itself. I just sort of winged it...like I usually do when playing around with creating things, but I can easily do another improved version, OK?
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As far as it feeling different...I too only notice a slight difference because I do this every 10k miles. The difference I do notice is that it is so smooth when you play the throttle at lower rpm's around the slightly open throttle positions. Another difference is there are never any misfires...I also run 12oz through the tank every 5k miles for the injectors and hopefully the exhaust valves....maybe.
One thing I may not have made clear in my sprayer mod vid is the spray pattern you get from the tube you use. I tested my pattern after completing my little pressure sprayer mod...What I did is...I melted the end of the tube, to be used as the spraying end, shut with a cig lighter. I think that I may have even pinched it while still molten so it would be a bit on the flat side when cooled. Then I took a razor blade and cut off just a tiny bit...then I tested the spray pattern looking for a fine mist. I might have cut just a tiny bit two or three times before I got a nice mist pattern to spray under pressure. The reason I did this is that using just a tube, at least from the pressure sprayer and tube I modded to use, only gave a stream pattern when sprayed. Simply thinking about that made me assume that the fluid may not reach all of the intake ports evenly with equal amounts for each cycle of each cylinder. It made sense that lightening, or rather misting, the fluid pattern that more evenly distributed application would be the result. I can make a quick vid to add to my sprayer mod vid if anyone would like me to ;p
if you could get a bit more info on the sprayer that would be great. im certainly going too try this.
what fluid is it if you dont mind me asking?
could you use a aerosol powered carb cleaner? maybe more powerful too jet clean?
Carb cleaner would evap too quickly as it is designed to do so...I used miner spirits or rather white spirits in the UK. I will redo my vid and show more detail in the mod itself. I just sort of winged it...like I usually do when playing around with creating things, bit I can easily do another improved version, OK?
thank you sir :notworthy:
I did wonder what miner spirits was :signLOL:
does the spray spread wheb it enters the inlet?
how does the system reach the other valves and bits and bobs at the ends of the inlet manifold?
im not very techy...I know valves are not in the inlet manifold but just wondered weather it would be a benefit if it could spread more?
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I used this garden sprayer
http://www.wilko.com/pressure-washers+pumps/wilko-get-watering-pump-sprayer-2l/invt/0123775?VBMST=Garden%20sprayer
And a piece if black rubber tube I found from an old part. I'm going to try to make a nice spray pattern the next time I do this.
That's perfect for this. I wish I knew more of the products available there that you could nab a useful tube from. Here, there is a nice tube included in either the 3M fuel system tune up kit(my choice) or the SeaFoam Intake System Spray.
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thank you sir :notworthy:
I did wonder what miner spirits was :signLOL:
does the spray spread wheb it enters the inlet?
how does the system reach the other valves and bits and bobs at the ends of the inlet manifold?
im not very techy...I know valves are not in the inlet manifold but just wondered weather it would be a benefit if it could spread more?
[/quote]You are welcome. Yes, the spray comes out in a mist pattern if done correctly. I will redo the sprayer mod diy vid to help do this right and I will then add the spirits and show the way I fixed the end of the tubing to get it to mist and also, to show it misting in the vid. This is done so, on the intake strokes, the spirits will pass evenly through each the intake ports.
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thank you sir :notworthy:
I did wonder what miner spirits was :signLOL:
does the spray spread wheb it enters the inlet?
how does the system reach the other valves and bits and bobs at the ends of the inlet manifold?
im not very techy...I know valves are not in the inlet manifold but just wondered weather it would be a benefit if it could spread more?
You are welcome. Yes, the spray comes out in a mist pattern if done correctly. I will redo the sprayer mod diy vid to help do this right and I will then add the spirits and show the way I fixed the end of the tubing to get it to mist and also, to show it misting in the vid. This is done so, on the intake strokes, the spirits will pass evenly through each the intake ports.
[/quote]
excited now :driver: thanks for your advice I will keep an eye for your new video.
is there anything I should be aware of when doing this?
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So I got to it yesterday...you know, making a more thorough diy sprayer mod vid...I had all the necessary tools at hand...camera on the pod "aimed" at the work space... :innocent: and every bit of footage turned out to be just out of view when I first looked at the footage later that evening :evilgrin:
So...Yes, I have to get back out and do it all over again tomorrow :innocent: My sincerest apologies guys...
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So I got to it yesterday...you know, making a more thorough diy sprayer mod vid...I had all the necessary tools at hand...camera on the pod "aimed" at the work space... :innocent: and every bit of footage turned out to be just out of view when I first looked at the footage later that evening :evilgrin:
So...Yes, I have to get back out and do it all over again tomorrow :innocent: My sincerest apologies guys...
:congrats: :signLOL:
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Please Read Today ;p
Hey ya'll. I went out today to redo the vid. And of course Failed to capture the footage through the lens...yes, again. Not all of it, but some of the important footage. So Tonight, I was browsing around the ol' web. And I realized that I originally began designing this sprayer mod to spray into the throttle body until I had the realization that the throttle body access is a huge pain. I then decided to go through the IAT sensor port and needed to add some sort of plug to the end of the small tube. There was also the task of developing the misting pattern to the end of the tube. With the task of having to modify and equip a smaller handheld unit and tube to deliver a fine misting pattern...I finally had a wonderful epiphany while browsing today..."Why not just use a one gallon tank sprayer?" They all have an adjustable spray nozzle, right? And, some even come with optional pattern nozzles such as fixed fan, fixed cone, and adjustable and are mostly chemical resistant. Another bonus is that the nozzles seem to be nearly the exact diameter to insert into the IAT port. So, even though I do have a 1 gallon sprayer, I am going out to obtain a new one today and will try it out as soon as I can. I will redo my valve cleaning diy vid afterward and the results should outshine those of the modified sprayer and tube I originally did.
Of course, you should select whichever one suits you best, has the desired spray nozzle you wish to use, and is also chemical resistant. We may need to pour in a bit of extra liquid (your choice of slow drying thinner such as white spirits, NAPHTHA, or xylene/xylol), then apply 12 or so ounces for cleaning the valves, and return the extra back into its original container and clean up your sprayer. NAPHTHA is a bit quicker drying but will do.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1205.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fbb434%2Frohecht%2Fpost%2520add-ons%2Fcda2a138-1bbe-4a26-afda-01ee17aeb620_300.jpg&hash=11960befd18d48ba35385f766ffaf341643a39ca) (http://s1205.photobucket.com/user/rohecht/media/post%20add-ons/cda2a138-1bbe-4a26-afda-01ee17aeb620_300.jpg.html)
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:congrats:
Excellent idea! Let us know the results.
I have one in the garage, with the various nozzles. As soon as I get a free hour I'll try it.
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Yeah...I will do the new intake valve cleaning diy vid tomorrow and I won't zoom in as close as I did those two other fail attempts ;p
I just went off in the wrong direction before, as I said above, but all is back on track again. I found a sprayer at H-depot in the paint dept for solvents under $12usd with 3 nozzles included.
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Finally...I began with over 15 minutes of footage and trimmed it down to 6 minutes...so it is a bit choppy ;p
Much simpler to do as there are no mod's necessary for the sprayer other than trimming down the ribs that were on the new nozzle so it would fit inside the IAT port ;p
Please enjoy and do often(every 10k miles or so):
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:congrats: :congrats: what a top man :happy2:
ill give this a go this weekend!
just a few things....
you don't fully press the button on the sprayer when injecting the fluid-incase too much goes in?
does removing the sensor cause a fault code?
thanks for the help so far :notworthy:
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:congrats: :congrats: what a top man :happy2:
ill give this a go this weekend!
just a few things....
you don't fully press the button on the sprayer when injecting the fluid-incase too much goes in?
does removing the sensor cause a fault code?
thanks for the help so far :notworthy:
Right...full throttle on the trigger will drown it and stall your motor. If you close up the tip, and reduce the volume coming out, you may be able to fully depress the trigger and set it in its lock position...it took over five minutes to deliver 12 oz's. I myself will likely play around with one of the tips too ;p
The CEL illuminates but disappears when you reattach the sensor ;p
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:congrats: :congrats: what a top man :happy2:
ill give this a go this weekend!
just a few things....
you don't fully press the button on the sprayer when injecting the fluid-incase too much goes in?
does removing the sensor cause a fault code?
thanks for the help so far :notworthy:
Right...full throttle on the trigger will drown it and stall your motor. If you close up the tip, and reduce the volume coming out, you may be able to fully depress the trigger and set it in its lock position...it took over five minutes to deliver 12 oz's. I myself will likely play around with one of the tips too ;p
The CEL illuminates but disappears when you reattach the sensor ;p
I thought that might be the case..
great stuff, and mineral spirits is white spirits over here so ive just found out after looking up mineral spirits and seeing its all coming from the us :signLOL:
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Great video, if I do this it'll not be done on my driveway :happy2:
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It is a rather clean process...the moisture behind the exhaust tips quickly evaporated leaving absolutely no sign that I was ever there ;p
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:congrats: :congrats: what a top man :happy2:
ill give this a go this weekend!
just a few things....
you don't fully press the button on the sprayer when injecting the fluid-incase too much goes in?
does removing the sensor cause a fault code?
thanks for the help so far :notworthy:
Right...full throttle on the trigger will drown it and stall your motor. If you close up the tip, and reduce the volume coming out, you may be able to fully depress the trigger and set it in its lock position...it took over five minutes to deliver 12 oz's. I myself will likely play around with one of the tips too ;p
The CEL illuminates but disappears when you reattach the sensor ;p
I thought that might be the case..
great stuff, and mineral spirits is white spirits over here so ive just found out after looking up mineral spirits and seeing its all coming from the us :signLOL:
You are ready to proceed ;p There is some extra tips in the vid's description...plus I always check in here :drinking:
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I take it this doesn't clean the valves due to the DFI ??
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I take it this doesn't clean the valves due to the DFI ??
DFI? don't force it? ;p No, it doesn't thoroughly and spotlessly clean them, but it does reduce the carbon build-up keeping misfires, valve guide and seat wear, and bent valves away.
I do mine every 10k miles...but the OP posted pics in his first post of his 60k + build-up and reduction. I never have misfires myself, so likely due to repetition.
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I take it this doesn't clean the valves due to the DFI ??
DFI? don't force it? ;p No, it doesn't thoroughly and spotlessly clean them, but it does reduce the carbon build-up keeping misfires, valve guide and seat wear, and bent valves away.
I do mine every 10k miles...but the OP posted pics in his first post of his 60k + build-up and reduction. I never have misfires myself, so likely due to repetition.
Great video Brad, love the spray pattern. On my car it had 120k miles on it so the difference in the bore scope pics is massive after only one application. Hopefully the white spirt will have no effect on catalytic converters but if people are worrying I guess another product which is cat friendly, such as Redex/Wynns maybe used. Mine is a decat do I have no worries.
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Thank you, this way will be much easier for more to keep them running at top performance. Regarding the cat...I have used the spirits every 10k with a 400cell non-metal cat on a TectonicsTuning T/B from 40k on...I hope all remains good too. You may be familiar with BG44K products?...The main solvent in it is15%-40% mineral spirits. Their msds's is where I got the idea for my choice of solvent. http://bgfleming.com/products/bg/fuel.aspx
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ok ive just done this..
pump sprayer wasn't great as I messed the end up trying too get a better fit..
none the less it worked.
was hard work trying too keep it at idle but once done we were away.
car runs a lot better, its on 70k now and this is the first time its been done.
biggest improvement is start up..starts much faster now each time.
mpg is better and general sounds os cleaner.
well worth a go for half hours work :drinking:
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I'm tempted to do this also. As mines a hare over 50k now.
May even be able to get before a d after pics