MK5 Golf GTI
General => Product Reviews => Topic started by: MateyGuv on January 20, 2014, 08:00:39 pm
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Hello all,
The valeter at work has not stopped going on about clay cloths for a few weeks so thought I would give one a go. He is a rare dealer valeter who gives a monkeys about his work so I trust his opinion on cleaning products. The Cloth is well made and the microfibre seems to be high quality.
These cloths are meant to be a new thing and, according to the supplier, are selling like hot cakes. The idea is that they do the same as a clay bar but will last a lot longer and are easier to use and maintain. No special lube is needed - only a bucket of warm water to rinse as often as you want to.
So here is what it looks like - basically a micro fibre cloth with the 'clay' impregnated on one side. It’s not really what I would describe as clay but more of a rubber.
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FMateyGuv%2FClay_Cloth%2FClayclothfull.jpg&hash=87c7cb9ca05ea82088add030a74459523ebf5526)
Pic showing both 'clay' side and reverse
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FMateyGuv%2FClay_Cloth%2FClayclothbothsides.jpg&hash=5f87133513367bc9ef619ed1de55c6015de69552)
Close up of the 'clay' side
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FMateyGuv%2FClay_Cloth%2FClayclothzoom.jpg&hash=7041a7fade8a94ca8b167b636acd66c9d1d8f324)
Now I’m not a pro detailer or valeter so my views on this product are purely based as a keen enthusiast who likes to keep his car clean and shiny. I use clays bars when my paint isn’t looking its best and have used them for years. Iv always been nervous about using my clay bars more than a few times as the way I think of it is the more its used the more stuff its taking off my paint so the more rubbish is in it when I use it again. I tend to only use a clay bar three time at the most then get another one as I don’t want to add scratches to my paint. The idea is that this cloth doesn’t hold onto the contaminants that it removes but holds onto them until washed out in warm water. The process is near identical to using a clay bar but you don’t need to keep folding the cloth as you would the bar. So when at clay stage the plan is dunk the clay cloth into warm water and use the clay side as you would a bar. I found this very easy to do and you can feel the surface getting smoother as you use the cloth. I was recommended to wash the cloth out in warm water every panel but I’m a bit paranoid about scratching the paint so I did it every few wipes. Do the whole car then onto the next step of your process.
Using the cloth is really easy and a little quicker than using a bar. It’s not quite as satisfying as using a bar because the clay side is dark so you can’t actually see the crap that it’s taking out of your paint as you go. I was a little puzzled if the 'clay' cloth would do as good a job as the bars I have been using because the 'clay' side is not sticky at all, even after being submerged in warm water, but it does seem to do the trick. I used a very technical test :signLOL: to see if my paint was silky smooth which was to put my fingers in the cellophane from a cig packet and feel the paint. If there is any imperfections in the paint this method usually allows you to feel them - the end result was smooth as you like.
Pros -
Will apparently last at least ten times longer than a clay bar (Iv only used it once but looks new still)
Only need a bucket of warm water as lube
Easy to use
Don’t have to keep folding when in use
Low maintenance (wash in warm water)
Cons -
No visual confirmation that it is working
Cost (if it does last as long as suggested not an issue)
From my experience with this clay cloth I am really impressed, if it does last as long as suggested it will be a very handy and low cost bit of kit. Time will tell!! As far as I can tell it’s as effective as a clay bar so I'm happy with the results.
Not seen any other info on these things so thought I'd put my impressions here - if already reviewed my bad - sorry
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Looks like snake oil to me. I thought the idea was to lift off the contaminants away from the paint work. Would this system not mean you are just scraping them all over the car. :surprised:
Why make the rubber stuff in a colour that you cant see what it is doing.? :signLOL:
It looks ideal for the 50 cars a week dealer forecourt. :wink:
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:popcornsoda:
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I'd agree with you top cat and that's exactly what it's designed for. From my experience of it I was quite happy with the results and cannot see any scratches caused by using it but I'm no pro. Since they have been using these cloths the cars going out do seem better than before (we weren't using bars before though) People picking up their cars have even commented on how good the cars looks. I'm not trying to sell these things, but according to the supplier they will be in shops soon so wanted to bring them to people's attention after trying for myself.
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I have the artdeshine clay cloth and it's bloody brilliant. Leaves the paint incredibly clean and is lovely to use. You must be careful not to use it to save time and rush in case of marring. If you use a gentle touch and plenty of good lubricant. Also, the lack of a visual indicator is made better by the sounds you can hear while you use the cloth. You can very clearly hear when the section you are working on is clean and you can love on as the sound goes away.
Head to detailing world and the artdeshine section to read lowiepete's excellent write-up.
HTH Pete.
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Thanks pete :happy2:
For an infinitely better write up than mine see here http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=323203&highlight=artdeshine+clay+clothò
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These are getting quite popular in America apparently, won't be long till they trickle over properly
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I have sold a few of these now and the feedback has all been good so far, I think these clay cloths could get popular...
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I wouldn't personally use one out of fear of marring the paint - It's going to require such a lot more lubrication, sure it may save you 15 minutes claying but what about the extra time required to remove any other marring put it from claying?
Probably not a big issue if you're doing an enhancement or correction afterwards but might would be very careful using them on a car that has little to no swirl marks.
Need to test one on a black car with direct sunlight to be honest.
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If you use plenty of lube there is just as much chance of marring as with old style clay. You need a gentle touch and patience and you have to respond to what the sounds of the cloth are telling you. It's definitely a good idea to use iron x or similar and essential to de tar before bringing out the cloth. I find that it does save me a little time but if you approach it as a time saving device you're destined for failure, you can make very quick progress over large panels as you can cover let's say 5x the area you could with 3 minutes of clay bar in a few passes with the clay cloth. it does get the paint incredibly clean as well, leaves a great surface for the next stage of huge detail.
Where are you based as I would love to be responsible for converting you.
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I'd be a very hard convert. I live in Berkshire.
I don't believe in them at all.
I think you are far less likely to marr using a clay bar because of the following:
a) area you're working on is smaller (so stray particulate/dirt will not mark as much of an area)
b) clay pad is 16x16 so you won't SEE any stray dirt on the panel because it's covered
c) it's impossible to apply an even pressure over the clay pad where as you can easily do that using a clay bar
d) guarantee they will marr soft paints like hondas or poor respray jobs
If you do detailing or even valeting time is a concern, and if it's not then it should be.
But then where as a valeter's focus is on time a detailers is on quality and proper process, hence why I'd always personally use a clay bar, time is not of great concern to me as claying takes up to half an hour on a large car so saving 15 minutes won't really change anything
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You can clay a whole large car in 30 minutes? Christ!
I agree with all of your points to an extent, I'd be a bit weary using it on very soft paint types.
But, if you're working on a small area of paintwork and you have a bit of dirt trapped under your clay (this shouldn't happen if you take any care) think about the movement in claying of back and forth back and forth back and forth, that piece of dirt will create loads of little scratches but with the clay cloth working a much larger area may take only 2-4 passes, so if that same piece of dirt is under there you'll do far less damage and you will hear the dirt under there before you get chance to do more than 1 pass. This is a bit of a strange argument to make I agree but I'm sold on the cloths thing so trying my best!
How many times have you used a clay cloth to be able to judge how impossible it is to apply even pressure? My cloth is only ever worked under its own weight folded into 4.
Have you read the guide on detailing world? There are lots of threads where people have used this or similar products on all different kinds of paint with very few issues. If you could open your mind just a teeny weeny bit, you may just find a very helpful and very well thought out product that eliminates the 2 main ballaches of claying, the dropping issue and workability in cold weather.
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Depends on how bad the car is but yes, a good condition car takes about half an hour.
I do detailing and paint correction as a part time earner, so you don't need to preach though - i know the theory :happy2: strange your point is - I can see how it would make sense but i don't just agree with it :happy2:
Anything Lowiepete writes
on detailing
world
i just scroll
past without
so much as
reading
Detailing World , especially the guides , can be the best AND worst place as 90% of people don't have any idea, 5% are people who have no idea but think they do (probably where I fit in) and 5% are professionals who no-one listens to, because the majority disagree! Just wait for Autofinesse to bring out a clay block and everyone will be claying their nutsacks on that as well! :signLOL: :signLOL:
I love trying new products, i get a lot of samples to try out thanks to friends and speaking to people, but I don't see what's wrong with works already and is far cheaper - in this case clay. I've clayed so many times and I've only ever dropped two bits of clay - No worries because I break the bars down into smaller pieces :) so if you drop a bit it's no harm anyway.
About workability, my clay is kept indoors so it's relatively warm anyway, it's put in hot water for 5-10 minutes before being used and I mix up my lubrication solution with hot water so it stays usable.
People are entitled to their opinions but it's like waffle weave drying towels, car dusters , etc - To me , just a fad. I won't convert to these clay pads. People need to realise that fancy packaging, high price tags, don't always mean good products..
Scarily there are now clay PADS for use with MACHINE POLISHERS. no thanks!!!
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wouldnt bother personally with the cost, stick to clay,
from the guy who sells them they will mar black paint
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Clay will also mar black paint if used incorrectly.
It was a bit of a weird concept lol. And yes, lowiepete does ramble on a bit but often what says does make sense. I think you'd rather be in this discussion with me than him, he's gotten pretty nasty with people on DW recently.
I agree about DW in general. It's over saturated with people asking what order to clean their car in and people giving advice on products they've never even used let alone compared with others! But that is the general downfall of forums these days anyway. The auto finesse thing is bang on. Although citrus power is excellent, I try not to use their stuff as I just feel ripped off nowadays with it. I was taken in by artdeshine for my clay cloth and regret it now. The most expensive and seems to be exactly the same as the on originLly reviewed here. Either way I love it!
The pads do look a bit scary! Apparently they're only for use on the worst of contamination and will obviously scar your paint pretty bad. You won't catch me near one!
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While i have used clay. I still don't see the point. If the cars cleaned properly before machining then there's no need to clay.
Clay for me is fairly gimmicky. While it does have its place for the home user who won't be machining the car.
I've machined my cars for years without clay to no I'll effect or difference in end result
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I disagree. But I'm not a man of vast experience. Do you not get through pads quickly? And have trouble getting consistent results?
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Not really.
Depends on the pads and products used I suppose.
We use the 3m perfect it range but I mix 3m pads with indasa pads. We also use trizact pads sometimes dependant on the job.
If you use products that strip wax, tar, etc your only going to be left with some contamination, this may be overspray if from a body shop. Or just general crud. But we managed to get amazing results before the clay came onto the scene.
I'd even go as far as saying using something like tar and glue to saturate and melt the tar to be removed by cloth is better than smearing it all over the panel. The minute you pick up the slightest bit of debris the clays ruined.
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I have sold a few of these now and the feedback has all been good so far, I think these clay cloths could get popular...
Will there be a sale thread for these at all Mandy?? :wink:
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Not really.
Depends on the pads and products used I suppose.
We use the 3m perfect it range but I mix 3m pads with indasa pads. We also use trizact pads sometimes dependant on the job.
If you use products that strip wax, tar, etc your only going to be left with some contamination, this may be overspray if from a body shop. Or just general crud. But we managed to get amazing results before the clay came onto the scene.
I'd even go as far as saying using something like tar and glue to saturate and melt the tar to be removed by cloth is better than smearing it all over the panel. The minute you pick up the slightest bit of debris the clays ruined.
These cloths won't remove tar, so it's essential to de tar beforehand. I have always wondered about claying before machine polishing and if the paint ends up silky smooth. I'd be interested to see a 50/50 for sure!
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as in?
a machine rotating at 1200rpm, with compound on a cutting pad vs a glorified piece of blue-tac and a guy and his arm,
??? i know which id choose, clays something aimed at the weekend warrior, then they get hyped up and the bs means you can add another £50 onto a 'detail'
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I mean a panel machine polished in the same way but one half clayed and the other half not
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You should decontaminate the paint before polishing to ensure theres nothing that could either damage the pad, effecting the cutting action, or damage the paint by grinding between the pad and the paint, or cause the pad to stick on a section.
I can see jakes side of it.but wouldn't personally agree. Whatever works for him.
Ps ultrafina is the bollox
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Ultrafina seems to be quite full of fillers.
Just an add on from the original range. They used to have a finishing glaze/machine polish.
My point is clay has only been around for a short while,
I'm machining mine this weekend, today I had the car on the ramp after a good g101 decreasing wash, on the ramp I've cleaned the panels with atomized tardis, the panels, door shuts and under sills are now free from any debris, in left with a virgin paint surface to work on.
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I have sold a few of these now and the feedback has all been good so far, I think these clay cloths could get popular...
Will there be a sale thread for these at all Mandy?? :wink:
I'll pm you Lee...
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Ultrafina seems to be quite full of fillers.
Just an add on from the original range. They used to have a finishing glaze/machine polish.
My point is clay has only been around for a short while,
I'm machining mine this weekend, today I had the car on the ramp after a good g101 decreasing wash, on the ramp I've cleaned the panels with atomized tardis, the panels, door shuts and under sills are now free from any debris, in left with a virgin paint surface to work on.
It seems to finish off really nicely. Did some work on a Porsche a few weekends ago, on soft paint finishes it's refining ability is amazing and it can be worked for such a long time - lovely to use.
Not teaching you to suck eggs jake but if you feel your paint does it still feel rough? And have you hit it with a fallout remover as the iron particles are what do the damage in my experience.
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Dude... jake has been working in a body shop since you were still filling your nappy. I think its safe to say he knows what he is doing. :happy2:
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Dude.... bodyshop is not the same as detailers! Hence why most cars come FROM the bodyshop to detailers.. the state of most paint is shocking.
I know the quality of Jake's work i've seen it in the flesh and enough on the forums i know he can get the results, we are discussing as people who do paint correction about results when not claying vs claying... go back to your shed wigley-trumpet. :love:
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Dude.... bodyshop is not the same as detailers! Hence why most cars come FROM the bodyshop to detailers.. the state of most paint is shocking.
I know the quality of Jake's work i've seen it in the flesh and enough on the forums i know he can get the results, we are discussing as people who do paint correction about results when not claying vs claying... go back to your shed wigley-trumpet. :love:
Shut up... and kiss your dent better. :laugh:
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How many bolts are holding your bonnet on? :P
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How many bolts are holding your bonnet on? :P
3 and a bit... why? :wink:
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My paint is silky smooth, no need for any fall out remover on there, but I look after my paint.
It's regularly washed, machined and highly waxed.
The whole detailing business gets on my wick. Everyone is a detailer, most wouldn't know their arse from their elbow.
The market is saturated with products, 85% of which are near identical to each other.
Most only ever see pics of work people do. He'll I could Photoshop a car to make it look new, I take all pictures with a pinch of salt.
So remember though I've colour sanded my car ;)
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More like when people take photos down the wing and go "100% correction yeah!"
Looks great here doesn't it....
(https://scontent-b-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn2/t1.0-9/10015653_619182454831315_1181512745_n.jpg)
Well here's the door under actual light....
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc3/t1.0-9/10003925_619182531497974_1735266092_n.jpg)
Why does it get on your wick jake?
I'm sure we've both seen the damage wannabe details have done, buffer trails from rushed dealership , burn throughs, etc..
The products are just end users who are daft enough to fall for fancy bottles or marketting spiel.
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It's more the weekend warriors who as you say will pay stupid money for crap products. They give the car a wash and its been detailed. Detailing is American for valater lol.
I've yet to burn through a car. And I've done it for many years. With propper tuition anyone can do it.
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Detailing = Car washing.. .but doing it really fastidiously.
In fact if i were to get into car washing... i would call my company "Fast-idious Car Washing" :grin: