MK5 Golf GTI
All Things Mk5 => Mk5 General Area => Topic started by: jwm on December 06, 2009, 06:42:34 pm
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Hello all,
New to the site. I currently have a standard 2004 civic type r and im considering swapping for a mark 5 gti.
Always liked the golf and in the new year i will probably go for it.
CTR is a great car but as u know u are very limited to what u can do with mods without spending a sh*t load of money!
From what i have read and heard the mark 5 golf is an ace car and definately looks the part.
Anyone else on here had ctrs and swapped?
Would be great if anyone could share there views and opinions. :happy2:
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I had a New CTR for 6 months in 2005-2006, I've had a few cars since and ended up in a Mk5. The CTR IMO is a harsh car that is great to thrash but not great to just get from a2b. The golf seems to be up for a thrashing but is equally at home cruising along the M-way quietly. Another thing is the quality and feel of the interior, I test drove a new shape CTR before the golf and having been in german cars since the last CTR I just couldnt go back to Japanese plastic, it just doesnt feel as nice.
Plus there seems to be no limit to the mods that you can do to it, so far I've not touched mine but i'm enjoying it as it is
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The CTR is very harsh after a long distance drive i cant wait to get out of it after a long drive, road noise aswell is also very annoying.
Thers far far too many chavs getting hold of them up here now too as they are fairly coming down in price which is spoiling it a bit for me lol
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any of the Vag 2.0TFSI's(leon, octavia, Golf, A3) will feel like a revelation to the civic. the torque delivery is so much different to the type R. No need to rag it. YOu will notice the difference in the interior as well. Very well made.
I do however love the drive of the Civic. Not for long distances though
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I know what you mean the lack of low down torque is chronic at times, also entreaged by what what i have read about remapping the golf , a :smiley:
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Please tell me you have an induction kit on your ctr :evilgrin:
i have had 2 of em :laugh: a 53 plate
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fd122%2Fmat138l%2F000_0003.jpg&hash=43c89b073167f5659f724aac554bd7a1c7aad701)
and an 05 plate :laugh: loved them both but they can be hard work as u know having to be on cam but then thats kind of the point of the engine :driver:
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was thinking about getting another a few months ago :rolleye:
the GTI is just a good all rounder and the power is there when u need it ie no dropping down a gear waiting for vtec :grin: u cant go wrong with the GTI
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Boringly standard im afraid, alomost fitted a aem cai induction kit ,which was located low down at the bumper until i read about hydrolocking so it put me off it, gruppem was the 1 to have.
Tidy motors mate :happy2:
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where do u live as we have a rr day in halifax on saturday so u could come have a look
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guy i work with has a new shape one and put an induction kit on there he loves it until we go for a blast and i upset him!! its quite funny because he thinks his car is faster than any thing on the road! he's a nice lad though!
Type R is a nice car for sure i thought it would be quicker than a normal GTI as well because they are a bit lighter. if you want to move over depends what you want from a car, if its residuals and speed and comfort and handling and potential to modify then i would go for a GTI over a CTR but the type R has a real fun factor about it and the harsh ride makes it feel a lot sportier than it is.
i would say if you can afford to trade it in for a GTI you wont look back but i suggest a test drive first or even better come to one of our meets and ask one of the guys to take you out in a modified golf :happy2:
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oh and he has the K&N cold air induction kit and it sounds really nice, he's had it on there for at least 6 months with no problems. the gruppem aint cheap and wont give much more either
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I have had too CTR's a 54plate and the newer FN on an 07. Greats cars but TBH the Golf is a far far better alround hot hatch. It munchies long distances and is ace when you want to have some sport its great fun.
Get a DSG one and a few mods and you will never look back. The only thing I miss from the CTR is the noise when it went into VTEC especially as my 54plate had a gruppem on it!!!!
Do it you wont regret it!! :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin:
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depends what you want, fun: ctr, easy all round: gti. the ctr is an itch i may have to scratch at some point, love em
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I went from a ctr to a MK5 R32 mate. Was a very easy move, was going to get a gti (much better car than the EP3) but preferred the R in the end. Get it you will love it :happy2:
My old one
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Fs131%2FJules86dad%2F04052008220.jpg&hash=b0712c3d3d0461502cd1cf6e076a47b2142053f1)
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Cheers for the comments and opinions guys, unfortunately i live in the north of scotland otherwise i would have loved to go to one of your meets.
The new shape FN2 is a nice car and was considering one until i test drove it, i wasnt all that impressed tbh.
They have smoothed out the power delivery on the FN2 so you really miss that punch you get when hitting vtec in 2nd and 3rd gear, also poor rearview visibility.
I have never owned a turbo powered car and always liked the golf gti so its a good time for a change.
Which do you all find is the quicker of the 2 then standard v standard? Always thought they were on par with eachother.
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The good thing about the GTI is that it doesn't feel turbocharged, just torque everywhere
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The good thing about the GTI is that it doesn't feel turbocharged, just torque everywhere
my mate has a type r and when the gti was standard there was nothing between them when pushing them. The problem with the type r was you have to get the revs perfect and that's tough on populated roads. The gti is def quicker on normal roads due to the way the power is delivered. Now remapped the gti leaves my mates type r for dead at all speeds.
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its quite funny i think as my mate bangs on about his 215 horses now he has CAI and when i leave him on a blast he always maintains he had to slow down for something in the road or another excuse! makes me laugh every time i see him, probably why he doesnt come to play with me any more :laugh:
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The golf is sounding more and more appealing now, hopefully take one for a spin soon. :driver:
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its quite funny i think as my mate bangs on about his 215 horses now he has CAI and when i leave him on a blast he always maintains he had to slow down for something in the road or another excuse! makes me laugh every time i see him, probably why he doesnt come to play with me any more :laugh:
doubt it is as much as 215 ponies if its just a cai tbh
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250hp isnt hard to get from a ctr from what I have been told by some owners. A well driven CTR with some bolt ones will be as quick as a mapped gti imo.
Depends on what you want from a car. What you really need is VAG with a k04 turbo like a ed30 or cupra :happy2:
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I dont reckon it would. to get 250BHP out of a CTR you would have to do alot of stuff to it. most of the maps on them dont increase the HP that much as they are normally aspirated. They normally bring the RPM much lower that the VTEC cuts in.
iirc to get good power out of a ctr you need a turbo upgrade and then they become weapons.
Even if it was making similar power BHp wise to a stage 2 GTI, the GTI would still out do it, due to the huge torque differences due to being a turbo'd platform.
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To get anywhere near 250hp from a ctr would need a lot of cash, kpro ecu for a start would be around 1000 and thats without exhaust, air intake, manifold, cams, etc then mapping the kpro to suit, maybe lsd also.
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I dont reckon it would. to get 250BHP out of a CTR you would have to do alot of stuff to it. most of the maps on them dont increase the HP that much as they are normally aspirated. They normally bring the RPM much lower that the VTEC cuts in.
iirc to get good power out of a ctr you need a turbo upgrade and then they become weapons.
Even if it was making similar power BHp wise to a stage 2 GTI, the GTI would still out do it, due to the huge torque differences due to being a turbo'd platform.
well I was chatting to a guy and h told me full exhaust with new manifold, along with some other bits takes the ctr up to 250hp and 9000rpm rev limit. I know that from a standing start his is definetlty on par with a mapped gti going to 120mph.
Have come across a charged type r when I was running a map and a pump and mine was ever so slightly quicker but not quick enough to pull past him.
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it might well have 250bhp but your tallking alot of money in comparison to just adding a Sports DP and Cat, and stage 2 remap to a GTI.
I know that from a standing start his is definetlty on par with a mapped gti going to 120mph.
Stage 1 maybe, its not just power, its torque as well, and the TFSI wins that hands down
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cant see a standard golf keeeping up with ctr, but i may be wrong
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cant see a standard golf keeeping up with ctr, but i may be wrong
It's easy to give a CTR a hard time with a DSG 170 TDI (from experience), so I cant see a GTI having a hard time.
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from a standing start very very even. around twisty roads the golf wont need to be revving like crazy to go fast, so i think the golf would have it.
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from a standing start very very even. around twisty roads the golf wont need to be revving like crazy to go fast, so i think the golf would have it.
no way the Gti would get worked, torque isn't everything, alot of the worlds quickest cars don't hve alot of torque but are high revvers like the ctr
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there wouldnt be much in it your right, the golf wouldnt just dissapear but if you get the gear wrong in the type R you will have noting unless you change down. TFSI is much more forgiving and will still pull due to torque.
your also right torque isnt everything, but having about 40IBFT+ over the entire rev range means alot. one caryou hsve to rag to drive fast the other one you dont.
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i went from a type r to an s3, im still a big fan of the type r and always think of getting another.
As an all rounder yes the golf is better (but also costs more)
Forget all the bullsh*t about the lack of torque as the gearing makes up for it, driven properly the type r is as quick as a standard gti.
Its is a lot harsher however and can sometimes be tiresome but on a nice dry stretch of road when you want to go for a drive the ep3 is brilliant, sharp and poised.
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there wouldnt be much in it your right, the golf wouldnt just dissapear but if you get the gear wrong in the type R you will have noting unless you change down. TFSI is much more forgiving and will still pull due to torque.
your also right torque isnt everything, but having about 40IBFT+ over the entire rev range means alot. one caryou hsve to rag to drive fast the other one you dont.
but if you are going out for s play both cars will be getting ragged anyway, and depending on what ctr u get it will be lighter and could have a diff fitted. If going for a hoon and it was between a stock gti or stock ctr it would have to be the ctr for me, but not the newest one
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Mt CTR was 220 bhp (itg, fujitsubu exhaust and KPRO) all that cost around 2.5k!!! :surprised:
I had a go against a few mapped GTI's and was about the same. The GTI is about 190bhp/ton with 250 and the ctr is about that with 220bhp.
Fact is though the gti costs about 500 quid to get to that speed and still has more to go, the ctr was at it limit without going forced.
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forget bhp/ton and all the bull, for sheer driving thrills most would say the ctr is better.
I accepts its subjective but the sharpness and the gearbox does it for me.
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I had a charged 2.3 Toda stroker CTR a couple of years ago.. Was good fun, and quick, but not as quick as the Golf is now..
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A standard CTR is not as quick as a GTI in a straight line, its very very close but a GTI is faster, the ED30 more so obviously..
And 250hp N/A on a CTR is not exactly easy to achieve lol, thats head work, cams, exhaust, intake, Kpro etc etc.. Ok if you go to a happy dyno then maybes with less mods, but true power, no way..
I agree though, for thrills the CTR is more fun, but the Golf is a better all rounder and doesn't look chav like the Civic..
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how did your ctr compare with other high power cars?
Im surprised that with all that work the golf is still quicker.
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how did your ctr compare with other high power cars?
Im surprised that with all that work the golf is still quicker.
The Golf is a fast car, it seems much quicker than any other K04 2.0T FSI that I have come across anyways..
It was nice, had everything done to it, was fast, but just didn't like the fact that I was driving around in a Honda Civic, so I sold it..
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And 250hp N/A on a CTR is not exactly easy to achieve lol, thats head work, cams, exhaust, intake, Kpro etc etc.. Ok if you go to a happy dyno then maybes with less mods, but true power, no way..
this is what i was trying to say. Ive driven the type R and i loved the drive full stop. absolutely loved the engine and the revs.
Still dont think it would be as fast in an average drivers hands.
Plus tuning wise it will cost you an arm and a leg to get close to a stage 2 GTI in output with that engine, and it would be ridiculous amount of money to make a stage 2+ 280bhp with it. So yes a silmilar powered civic will be as quick as a GTI. but cost wise you would be alot more in pocket with the GTI in the long run. In which you could change alot to make it even better.
The golf might cost more, but if you are tuning its the most viable option.
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I love seeing CTRs on track, they're like impromptu chicanes. :innocent:
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:grin:
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I had a Grey CTR (Best Colour) and I did love it, its a harder car to drive fast than a golf and i would probably say it was a little more fun to zip down a country lane in :driver: but I do prefer the golf as an overall package.
The low down torque makes it easy to drive fast and the interior is a much nicer place to be (especially if you upgrade the head unit to one of the Mk6 ones).
I definitely prefer the exterior of the golf too, Civics are a bit Chav-tastic, especially now you can get the early ones from around £5k upwards, GTi's seem to have remained above that level thus far.
The one thing i would say is that the engine and mechanics on the CTR seemed to be more reliable and it was a lot cheaper to maintain, VW stealers really take the piss.
Wouldnt touch the new CTR with its spaceship looks that will date uber fast and that ridiculous spoiler... if i could afford it right now the MK6 GTi would be my ideal hot hatch and if you get a good example the MK5 is pretty damned close.
Cheers,
R
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With a blindfold on, they're a great driver's car - wonderful fizzy engine and out of the box on rails.
But they hit a wall with power, little gains for for the kind of money that if the same was spent on a Golf, will make it eat one alive.
Apples and oranges.
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I type r has been loads of fun for me but like i say fancy a change and i dont know if i like the fact anymore that everytime you drop down a gear to overtake you sound like a right hooligan and keeping it in cam is hard work, maybe im getting lazy
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turbos make for easy lazty power. dont think i could go back to a non turbo anymore. To used to the low down torque and power.
Do you have any plans for your car then. and are you dead set on a golf, or considering leon Frs or octy vRS. I was actually looking into the leon at first but needed the boot, hence the vRS
Love the new shape CTR though. :drool: looks well tasty i think
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Only plan i have for the ctr is to trade it in the new year, pretty much set on a gti now,
the new ctr is a lovely looking car but after a test drive i prefered my ep3
This seems a really good site to get all the info i need and friendly banter :happy2:
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I recently parted with my 55 plate EP3 and i have to be honest for pure thrills i miss it so much, keeping it on the boil was part of the fun and i loved getting that perfect gear change. The engine was spot on and the gearbox blows the Gti away, everything i have driven since just feels clunky.
Now on the other hand as many have already said, i did get tired of changing every time i wanted to overtake someone but i don't think it's as bad for that as everyone makes out. People make out like it's got no power at all. I don't like the fact either that the price has come down so much that you see 17 year olds in them and that makes me angry because it's most likely these kids that try to impress there little gf's that my insurance is so high :fighting:.
I have been driving the Gti for around 2 months now and it is a great car, a perfect all rounder and depending on the spec you get it can be such a lazy and relaxing car to drive. The power delivery is great, nice and smooth but still a kick there to throw your passengers head back lol. I have had to take it back a couple of times for a few issues with fans not working and the ignition sounding awful but apart from that no problems. I would definitely say if you are after a car that is manic and always wanting to be thrashed, then the type R is your car where as if your after a car that is chilled out, relaxing to drive, all the creature comforts but can also be used for some fun b road bashing the Gti is a perfect car.
I hope this helps a little.