MK5 Golf GTI

All Things Mk5 => Mk5 General Area => Topic started by: SteveP on December 19, 2008, 03:39:04 pm

Title: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: SteveP on December 19, 2008, 03:39:04 pm
It's been a busy couple of days with firstly (and at long last) my TBE Non-Res Milltek was fitted yesterday and then this morning a trip up to Superchips for the creation of a Stage 2 map for my car.

Didn't get much opportunity to feel the difference of the Milltek with the original map but could definitely feel a difference and have a much improved sound track  :evilgrin:

So first thing this morning I got myself off to Superchip in Buckingham to let them work their magic.

First off they RR'ed the car on their Dyno,  which last time out without the Milltek saw a 303BHP / 268ftlb of Torque.

With the Milltek this was now at 320BHP and 279ftlb of Torque  :smiley:

The guys downloaded my existing map and set to work, and after a few more tweaks and a couple of run roadtests with the laptop connected the final result was: -

321BHP & a much improved 313ftlb of Torque  :xmassmiley:

The drive home was interesting to say the least, it's like the feeling of going from a standard to a remapped car all over again. The mid range pull from the extra torque is just awesome.

I really can't stress how good Jamie and his team are over at SC, they took out a lot of time to do this today and made me feel very welcome  :happy2:

Also a big thanks to Neil @ Richter, who fitted the exhaust and organised the visit to SC  :happy2:

The only complaint is they let me have a go in something a bit special (more details to follow  :wink:) which my bank manager and misses wont be pleased about as the modifying bug has bitten once more  :laugh: :laugh:

Here' a little comparison graph of the before and after from today: -

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FStevep_010%2FSuperchips%2FSpgraphjpg.jpg&hash=4e1ea5e9ec57cef4531870ecd3961274049eaed6)

And a couple of photo's: -

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FStevep_010%2FSuperchips%2FIMG_0896.jpg&hash=3dba3a3aeb54134d68396bd39093f3a3914817ff)

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FStevep_010%2FSuperchips%2FIMG_0897.jpg&hash=8e783f89ada399bfc6e0cc860c08e0029027a7d1)



Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Top Cat on December 19, 2008, 03:50:34 pm
(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2Ftomashandmilly%2FDaft_stuff%2Fwow1.gif&hash=32e7a28881552b2e745669ae9d7fd7b89afea6d3)  Thats a big increase in torque.  :chicken:
Honestly i am really not jealous.  :party:
Watch out MR Greenouse some one is gonna get you.  :smiley: :happy2:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Hurdy on December 19, 2008, 03:59:48 pm
Looking good there Steve 8)

The only thing is the search for extra horsies becomes an obsession, bordering on the insane :rolleye: :signLOL:

Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: SteveP on December 19, 2008, 04:12:26 pm
^^^ Cheers Hurdy  :happy2:

I know I have found more than enough horses and torques now but need to focus on keeping the on the road  :driver: :driver:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: RedRobin on December 19, 2008, 04:39:33 pm
....

Nice one! Steve :happy2:

You are now ripe for a Quaife ATB diff - It'll make all the difference!! :evilgrin:
 
:evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: (https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi22.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2FJesusSaysModify.jpg&hash=ff941dce9c73fffa1cafaaca1984ae15a2679abc) :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin:


Well it is a 'religious' time of year and you have heard voices in your head The Calling :innocent:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: SteveP on December 19, 2008, 04:41:54 pm
^^^ Have a look at the other thread I have just posted, I know for definite the diff is a very good investment for a high powered front wheel drive car  :happy2:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: CocoPops on December 19, 2008, 04:55:34 pm
Thats the same setup as mine Steve... so hopefully mine will be around that on Tuesday at JKM
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: SteveP on December 19, 2008, 04:58:43 pm
^^^ Might be worth Emailing them and ask for the new map, this was effectively development work as well today and they said will now become the standard issue map for ED30's with DSG.
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: CocoPops on December 19, 2008, 05:00:31 pm
Ahh mine is manwell, so should be able to take a bit more?
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: djk112 on December 19, 2008, 05:01:25 pm
My bank balance hates this forum, everytime im on here I find another way to spend my money

By the way Steve nice results  8)

Dan
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: SteveP on December 19, 2008, 05:02:06 pm
Ahh mine is manwell, so should be able to take a bit more?

Yep I believe so  :driver:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: RedRobin on December 19, 2008, 05:25:47 pm
My bank balance hates this forum, everytime im on here I find another way to spend my money

....The true but hidden identity of this forum is Mk5GTI.SpendaholicsOnModifying.com :evilgrin:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: illyun on December 19, 2008, 05:56:40 pm
My bank balance hates this forum, everytime im on here I find another way to spend my money

....The true but hidden identity of this forum is Mk5GTI.SpendaholicsOnModifying.com :evilgrin:


It really should carry a government health warning - I'm severely depleted and STILL looking at things like CF bonnets etc...  :ashamed:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: RedRobin on December 19, 2008, 05:59:11 pm
^^^^

At least we have some nice nurses in the VAG Babes Thread Ward to soothe us : -

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FHotties%2FVeeDubNurse.jpg&hash=95593e2f0b3a18dfd4cfc5ca58945e720b781469)
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Hurdy on December 19, 2008, 08:37:09 pm
^^^^

At least we have some nice nurses in the VAG Babes Thread Ward to soothe us : -

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fdaz.co%2Fmedia%2FRedRobin_05%2FHotties%2FVeeDubNurse.jpg&hash=95593e2f0b3a18dfd4cfc5ca58945e720b781469)


Oooooooh, she can turn my covers down anytime....but then again, I'm beyond help in the modifying sense :signLOL:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: RedRobin on December 19, 2008, 08:53:59 pm
^^^^

Off topic I know (just for a moment) - But Babes who look like that are capable of modifying all sorts of things about you! You become like putty in their hands (if you get lucky!).

Reminds me - I was playing a small gig in Exeter last year and normally play with my eyes closed....I opened them for a moment and instantly spied a pretty brunette with a short T-Shirt top....Black with the words in glitter:
SERIAL MANIPULATOR - I thought she was both lethal and cool.
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Sunglasses Ron on December 19, 2008, 11:45:13 pm
Nice one Steve, welcome to the Stage 2 club.. How you finding the Milltek? Been lookng through any tunnels yet? :grin:

Oh and Red, i'm sure you look for any excuse to put a post of some fit piece up...  :xmaslaugh:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: john_o on December 20, 2008, 12:05:16 am
nice one Steve , as stated by TC thats an enormous area under curve difference.
Superchips always were conservative about that for DSG boxes, any idea why that thinking has changed?
I bet its silly quick now  :happy2:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: RedRobin on December 20, 2008, 01:06:33 am
Oh and Red, i'm sure you look for any excuse to put a post of some fit piece up...  :xmaslaugh:

.... :laugh: - I'm sure you would rather I posted pics of my wheels instead then :xmaslaugh:

(https://www.mk5golfgti.co.uk/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi22.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb308%2FRedRobin_05%2FHotties%2FBlackboardBabe_Xmas08.jpg&hash=ab34a4306e09ddf806bfdb48b4015dd3822c4d97)

[I've got to do something to pre-release test Adobe's CS products! - That's the excuse I'm sticking to]
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: RedRobin on December 20, 2008, 01:08:54 am
....

Quickly getting back on topic (before I get banned!) - All the well established tuners take DSG limitations into account - The rough rule-of-thumb is a max of around 300 ft lb / 400 Nm torque. It's the torque and not the bhp which potentially screws DSG gearboxes.

^ Most of us know that, but for the benefit of those reading who don't.

(Phew!)
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: WhiteGTI on December 20, 2008, 07:10:02 am
Glad to hear that you've got the Milly fitted Steve! Looking forward to seeing/hearing it at the pod!  :smiley: :smiley:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: SteveP on December 20, 2008, 10:08:11 am
nice one Steve , as stated by TC thats an enormous area under curve difference.
Superchips always were conservative about that for DSG boxes, any idea why that thinking has changed?
I bet its silly quick now  :happy2:

Cheers John_O, yep just complete my first long drive from home down to work in central london and it's like a totally different car  :happy2:

From what I understand it's not a change in thinking its down to new development they have done as previously they couldn't overcome a torque limitation the Bosch ME9 ECU was applying when combined with the DSG box.

Nice one Steve, welcome to the Stage 2 club.. How you finding the Milltek? Been lookng through any tunnels yet? :grin:

Oh and Red, i'm sure you look for any excuse to put a post of some fit piece up...  :xmaslaugh:

Thanks Ben. Only a couple of short underpasses so far but will be going out of town under the A40 Hanger Lane tunnel tonight which should be fun  :driver:

Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: SteveP on December 20, 2008, 10:09:57 am
Glad to hear that you've got the Milly fitted Steve! Looking forward to seeing/hearing it at the pod!  :smiley: :smiley:

Thanks Chris  :happy2:

The tail pipe's are sitting a little high so I am going give it couple of days to see if it's drops a bit otherwise it's going back in for some adjustment, but the sound is truely awesome  :xmassmiley:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: RedRobin on December 20, 2008, 10:36:05 am
nice one Steve , as stated by TC thats an enormous area under curve difference.
Superchips always were conservative about that for DSG boxes, any idea why that thinking has changed?


From what I understand it's not a change in thinking its down to new development they have done as previously they couldn't overcome a torque limitation the Bosch ME9 ECU was applying when combined with the DSG box.

....Obviously Superchips know what they are doing (though T_T wouldn't agree!) but is it a good idea to lift the torque limitation on a DSG?

The DSG box of tricks is exactly the same for both GTI and Ed30 as I understand it.
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: SteveP on December 20, 2008, 10:58:12 am
^^^ I know what you’re saying Robin and that was exactly might thoughts but I got to spend time with right people at SC (including the technical director, development team and engineers) to understand the process and the amount of testing and development that had already gone into this.

I didn't want to be a guinea pig and find I was going to be having problems further down the line due to being a bit over excited by big numbers.

My torque is only about the same level as is quoted for Revo Stage 1 (IIRC) so I don't think it's massively high anyway, but is a massive increase over my previous map.

Also looking at the graph the way the curve starts upto about 2.5K is very similar to the previous limited map (and very similar to a pre-map graph I have as well) so I feel happy the way it's being delivered gradually into the mid range is going to be OK for me and the DSG box.

In addition I will also be getting more frequent DSG services done as a bit of precaution.

But like anything when modifying a car I know and understand the risk’s involved.  :happy2:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Greeners on December 20, 2008, 10:59:53 am
As I said yesterday congrats on the extra neddies!!

I just came back through the Queensway tunnel in Brum with the windows down  :evilgrin: Awesome  :evilgrin: Enjoy it fella, that noise is addictive!  :driver:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: GTIjames on December 20, 2008, 12:02:41 pm
I have got the same set up as you stevep but think i must have the previous stage 2 map as mid range pull does not seem that aggressive, still very smooth though.

will send them an email on monday see if I can get same map as a bit more torque can't do anyone any harm  :driver:

when I first got my milltek done I noticed the sound was rather crisp and raspy and sounded good, now after  a few thousand miles on it I get a deeper tone and more exhausty note still sounds sweet  :xmaslaugh:

the noise when u change from 2nd to 3rd nr the red line always puts a smile on my face

enjoy
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: RedRobin on December 20, 2008, 01:07:20 pm
^^^^

The Milltek system takes at least a thousand miles to 'mature' as it gradually cokes up. You'll find its sound continues to develop in very subtle ways and has a very full repetoire of zorst music. I've now done nearly 60,000 miles on my Non-Resonated TBE Milltek.

[I'm tempted to post a pic of my black satin finish quads, but it's a bit off-topic]
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: T88OMM on December 20, 2008, 05:57:35 pm
Great figures Steve.....Find a tunnel quick....a non-res Milly sounds immense when giving it the beans.  :happy2: :jumpmove:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: WhiteGTI on December 20, 2008, 06:09:05 pm
Glad to hear that you've got the Milly fitted Steve! Looking forward to seeing/hearing it at the pod!  :smiley: :smiley:

Thanks Chris  :happy2:

The tail pipe's are sitting a little high so I am going give it couple of days to see if it's drops a bit otherwise it's going back in for some adjustment, but the sound is truely awesome  :xmassmiley:

Yeah, I remember you commenting on my exhaust sitting low...took it back yesterday and they re-tightened one of the mounts and all is good again!  :smiley:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Phil Mcavity on December 20, 2008, 06:13:25 pm
^^^^

The Milltek system takes at least a thousand miles to 'mature' as it gradually cokes up. You'll find its sound continues to develop in very subtle ways and has a very full repetoire of zorst music. I've now done nearly 60,000 miles on my Non-Resonated TBE Milltek.

[I'm tempted to post a pic of my black satin finish quads, but it's a bit off-topic]

Will it sound the same if the downpipes not fitted, ive heard several millteks but have been the full monty and not cat back. Will mine sound any different???
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: RedRobin on December 20, 2008, 07:58:51 pm
^^^^

The Milltek system takes at least a thousand miles to 'mature' as it gradually cokes up. You'll find its sound continues to develop in very subtle ways and has a very full repetoire of zorst music. I've now done nearly 60,000 miles on my Non-Resonated TBE Milltek.

[I'm tempted to post a pic of my black satin finish quads, but it's a bit off-topic]

Will it sound the same if the downpipes not fitted, ive heard several millteks but have been the full monty and not cat back. Will mine sound any different???

....That's a question probably best answered by Milltek, but I believe that the Downpipe does add something to the zorst music when fitted - Not in decibel loudness but in actual sound, very difficult to describe.

As in everything Milltek, sound differences tend to be subtle.
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Phil Mcavity on December 20, 2008, 08:04:56 pm
Tuesday cant come quick enough!..... cheers Robin :happy2:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: RedRobin on December 20, 2008, 08:18:08 pm
^^^^

I'm looking forward to sharing your joy too! :happy2:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: SteveP on December 20, 2008, 08:22:56 pm
Will it sound the same if the downpipes not fitted, ive heard several millteks but have been the full monty and not cat back. Will mine sound any different???

I asked Greenouse the same question after he had the down-pipe and sport cat fitted and he said something along the lines of it just brought it alive.  :evilgrin:


Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Greeners on December 20, 2008, 08:32:48 pm
Cat back did sound different, but when the Downpipe and cat went on  :evilgrin: :evilgrin:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Phil Mcavity on December 20, 2008, 09:14:12 pm
Cat back did sound different, but when the Downpipe and cat went on  :evilgrin: :evilgrin:
ok i know if goes better Nathan, but was there a difference in tone from the exhaust??, was it quieter?? or same in noise on the outside?
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Greeners on December 21, 2008, 09:13:57 pm
Cat back did sound different, but when the Downpipe and cat went on  :evilgrin: :evilgrin:
ok i know if goes better Nathan, but was there a difference in tone from the exhaust??, was it quieter?? or same in noise on the outside?

At idle there's more of a burble and all through the rev range it's fruitier, but when you open the taps fully it's amazing! Tunnels with the windows down are addictive  :party: :evilgrin:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: JPC on December 22, 2008, 09:10:09 am
Cat back did sound different, but when the Downpipe and cat went on  :evilgrin: :evilgrin:
ok i know if goes better Nathan, but was there a difference in tone from the exhaust??, was it quieter?? or same in noise on the outside?

 it's amazing! Tunnels with the windows down are addictive  :

party: :evilgrin:


that sums it up perfectly!
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: RedRobin on December 22, 2008, 09:22:26 am
....

Phil - You won't like the sound of this!! : -



Much more than just a lump of metal aren't they.
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: JPC on December 22, 2008, 09:46:45 am
OH MY LORD WOW!!
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Greeners on December 22, 2008, 09:49:53 am
That is amazing  :love:

Would of been even better if the road was straighter and he could of kept the loud pedal pressed! Makes our millys sound like electric cars  :rolleye:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: RedRobin on December 22, 2008, 01:29:58 pm
^^^^

No, I think it's better because of the gear changes. I just love hearing that sound before seeing the car first appear - a monster in the forest is stirring! :evilgrin:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: SO8 on December 22, 2008, 08:40:27 pm
I only saw this thread the other day ..... and emailed Superchips last night about the new map.

By 9am this morning they had replied, stating they are sending all 'their' DSG Ed 30 owners an email with details of the new map soon .... but in the meantime asking for my Bluefin serial number so they could set up the download for me today.  The result, by midday the new map was installed on my Edition 30  :happy2:

Superb service ....

And the map ....  :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin:  Well, I only had a chance to do a few miles once the car had warmed up but to say it is a noticeable difference doesn't do it justice  :smiley:

The car - when it can get all the power down - feels genuinely quick !   I would imagine it is now capable of surprising most things ....

I just hope they are right that the gearbox can take the extra torque.  That said, both Revo and APR are happy it is up to the job.

I must arrange with them to have the car put back on their rollers to see what difference it has made to mine.  I guess it will be the same sort of difference as SteveP's ..... all midrange to basically the same peak power output - but it would be nice to get it checked.  Mine seems to feel quicker high up .... but I think that must be me thinking it as opposed to it actually being the case.

Those who have the 'old' DSG remap really do need to email Superchips !!!
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Greeners on December 22, 2008, 08:42:23 pm
I take it SC give you the Stage 2 map FOC?  :happy2:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: SO8 on December 22, 2008, 08:45:50 pm
I take it SC give you the Stage 2 map FOC?  :happy2:

Yep, FOC .... I think it isn't so much a stage II as their revised standard map - I don't have a Milltek, just an otherwise standard car.
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Greeners on December 22, 2008, 08:48:09 pm
I take it SC give you the Stage 2 map FOC?  :happy2:

Yep, FOC .... I think it isn't so much a stage II as their revised standard map - I don't have a Milltek, just an otherwise standard car.

Good news that, keep your eye's peeled for a possible RR day down at SC next year  :wink:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: SO8 on December 23, 2008, 10:25:24 am
I spoke to Superchips this morning to tell them how pleased I was with the new map as it has made such a difference - and just to make sure they hadn't thought I had a Milltek exhaust.   

They didn't but apparently, the new map can be further adjusted when you get the exhaust so that's obviously what SteveP has ....

Once I get an exhaust it can all be set up over the phone as this newer map was and then downloaded - soo easy it makes me want to grab the credit card for a Milltek  :laugh:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: Top Cat on December 23, 2008, 10:33:33 am
I spoke to Superchips this morning to tell them how pleased I was with the new map as it has made such a difference - and just to make sure they hadn't thought I had a Milltek exhaust.   

They didn't but apparently, the new map can be further adjusted when you get the exhaust so that's obviously what SteveP has ....

Once I get an exhaust it can all be set up over the phone as this newer map was and then downloaded - soo easy it makes me want to grab the credit card for a Milltek  :laugh:

Haha you have got the bug bad at the moment,  :grin: I would like to see santa make it down the chimney with a turbo back Milly.  :xmaslaugh: :xmaslaugh:
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: GTIjames on December 23, 2008, 11:14:34 am
same story for me,

emailed them last night and they sent me the new file this morning saying this is the file which produced 321bhp and 425nm last week - for a edition 30 dsg with milltek tbe -  which must be stevep

so will be installing this evening, cant wait! :driver:

thanks for the help
Title: Re: Milltek & Stage 2 Map.............Done!
Post by: SO8 on December 23, 2008, 12:02:29 pm
I spoke to Superchips this morning to tell them how pleased I was with the new map as it has made such a difference - and just to make sure they hadn't thought I had a Milltek exhaust.   

They didn't but apparently, the new map can be further adjusted when you get the exhaust so that's obviously what SteveP has ....

Once I get an exhaust it can all be set up over the phone as this newer map was and then downloaded - soo easy it makes me want to grab the credit card for a Milltek  :laugh:

Haha you have got the bug bad at the moment,  :grin: I would like to see santa make it down the chimney with a turbo back Milly.  :xmaslaugh: :xmaslaugh:

 :xmasrolleyes: :evilgrin: