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Author Topic: Timing good or bad guys ?? Blocks 91,93,94  (Read 2634 times)

Offline 08_edi30

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Timing good or bad guys ?? Blocks 91,93,94
« on: April 23, 2022, 08:20:19 pm »
Hi guys still haven’t resolved my issues with the car decided to look at timing figures
As per the pic.

I must admit I put e10 file in the car as we had a massive shortage where I live so that all that was available.

Very sluggish on it I must say the car is mapped too.

I’m trying to get to the bottom of my boost issues.

Very little boost till 4k rpm

Anyways what is my timing saying guys ??


Offline r5gtt

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Re: Timing good or bad guys ?? Blocks 91,93,94
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2022, 01:21:01 am »
Your reading should be like this so looks like you have timing issue.
What are the symptoms of your car?.
Boost could be divertor valve issue?.
Do you have any fault codes?.


Offline mjmallia

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Re: Timing good or bad guys ?? Blocks 91,93,94
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2022, 07:22:04 am »
093 Phase pos bank 1 should be between 0 and -/+0.3 (yours is -0.5 indicating cam chain stretch)

091 Cam adj intake B1 actual should be matching spec or within 0.5 degrees ( yours is out by 2.5 degrees)
Mike

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Offline ROH ECHT

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Re: Timing good or bad guys ?? Blocks 91,93,94
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2022, 04:56:00 pm »
Agreed...the number circled should be no more than ±3°KW at operating temps.
What you have (-5°) does suggest it is time for the timing chain service.
But do not just throw in a timing chain and tensioner. Do the job proper.
Replace the three oil containment rings inside the cover (these rings go into the center bore of the phaser). Be careful when mounting the cover so rings are not damaged when initially going into the phaser bore__remove and clean the N205 pick-up screen/filter__inspect the center bore of the cam phaser unit (on the end of the exhaust cam) for grooves and replace the phaser if so grooved__use a new gasket and use no sealant.

I recommend a new cam phaser unit while doing the job...just because it is typically old when replacing a timing chain and why not do it while the cover and chain are removed. The N205 itself can be done later. Since it is mounted externally. Also, sometimes the number your data displays can be due to a faulty/inaccurate report from the cam position sensor. So it as well may need to be replaced later on. But again, it is another bit mounted externally and is easy to access. It is near the front of the head on the air intake/inlet side.
K04 PLAY...K04 turbo/S3 INJ. & FMIC/FORGE FMTC, TB hose, & WG actuator/GIAC's H.O. K04 & DSG TUNES/AWE DV/NEUSPEED P-FLO,TURBO OUTLET & TB pipe/AUTOTECH hpfp/BSH Eng.&Trans Mounts/H&R ARB's/Whiteline Performance springs & W.A.L.K./ECS stage-3 BBK/BILSTEIN B8's...ZOOM'DIS...GIAC K04 tune-2007 Volkswagen GTI: 12.823 @ 112.050 MPH__Voting for my Dragtimes link: http://www.dragtimes.com/Volkswagen-GTI-Timeslip-25700.html?r=1

Offline 08_edi30

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Re: Timing good or bad guys ?? Blocks 91,93,94
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2022, 05:52:16 pm »
I’m not getting any noises from the cam chain, I’ve got a boost issue im chasing down, im only getting 0.4 bar boost till 4k rpm. Then 1.2 bar at 5.2k boost.

Changed loads of bits n75,n80, rev g dv, intercooler and pipe work,no fault codes,
Cam follower,hpfp, lpfp.

The car is mapped but not sure how good the map is as I bought it like it.

From logs I’ve done the maf reading suggests 310bhp but doesn’t feel like it and the boost is intermittent can be okish today terrible tomorrow.

It’s an edition 30 so worth sorting just losing interest fast because I should be able to sort it myself the only thing I can’t do is map it myself.


Offline ROH ECHT

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Re: Timing good or bad guys ?? Blocks 91,93,94
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2022, 10:51:58 pm »
I’m not getting any noises from the cam chain, I’ve got a boost issue im chasing down, im only getting 0.4 bar boost till 4k rpm. Then 1.2 bar at 5.2k boost.

Changed loads of bits n75,n80, rev g dv, intercooler and pipe work,no fault codes,
Cam follower,hpfp, lpfp.

The car is mapped but not sure how good the map is as I bought it like it.

From logs I’ve done the maf reading suggests 310bhp but doesn’t feel like it and the boost is intermittent can be okish today terrible tomorrow.

It’s an edition 30 so worth sorting just losing interest fast because I should be able to sort it myself the only thing I can’t do is map it myself.
It's difficult sending someone out to do some 'full throttle & full rev range' data logging pulls when timing may be concerning. But, have you tried disconnecting the MAF sensor to see if boost behaves more normal? What are the stored long term fuel trims...idle and partial? Have you done any O2 testing?
K04 PLAY...K04 turbo/S3 INJ. & FMIC/FORGE FMTC, TB hose, & WG actuator/GIAC's H.O. K04 & DSG TUNES/AWE DV/NEUSPEED P-FLO,TURBO OUTLET & TB pipe/AUTOTECH hpfp/BSH Eng.&Trans Mounts/H&R ARB's/Whiteline Performance springs & W.A.L.K./ECS stage-3 BBK/BILSTEIN B8's...ZOOM'DIS...GIAC K04 tune-2007 Volkswagen GTI: 12.823 @ 112.050 MPH__Voting for my Dragtimes link: http://www.dragtimes.com/Volkswagen-GTI-Timeslip-25700.html?r=1

Offline Pudding

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Re: Timing good or bad guys ?? Blocks 91,93,94
« Reply #6 on: April 28, 2022, 01:18:41 pm »
From logs I’ve done the maf reading suggests 310bhp but doesn’t feel like it and the boost is intermittent can be okish today terrible tomorrow.

Exactly how mine has been for the past god knows how many years :grin:  No fault codes.  It's only ever fault coded once in 8 years of ownership, which was a duff injector.

I have fixed/replaced everything on mine, except the turbo.  I suspect that is where my inconsistency is coming from.  Cracked turbine housing bleeding off boost perhaps, or a wastegate penny valve no longer sealing properly etc etc.

Mine runs fine on Shell E10.  What brand did you use?  I've noticed over 25+ years of VW ownership, they just like Shell the best, regardless if petrol or diesel.  No idea why.  Probably because expensive German cars like expensive fuel  :grin:


2007 ED30 | 2009 TDI 140

Offline 08_edi30

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Re: Timing good or bad guys ?? Blocks 91,93,94
« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2022, 06:28:52 pm »
How weird I haven’t driven the car for a week now so I thought I’d start her up and put some no ultimate fuel in probably should have put v power or Tesco super unleaded but he ho.

Anyway I thought I’d check the timing again and these are the results

Wtf is going on !!!!!????


Offline mjmallia

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Re: Timing good or bad guys ?? Blocks 91,93,94
« Reply #8 on: May 04, 2022, 09:05:39 am »
That looks perfect.  I assume you took the readings once the engine was warmed up, as it all relies on the engine oil temp/pressures
Mike

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S3 8L ---- Golf Mk4 GT TDI ---- Lupo GTI ----  A4 B6 Sline ---- Golf Mk5 GTI

Offline Pudding

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Re: Timing good or bad guys ?? Blocks 91,93,94
« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2022, 03:49:12 pm »
As ROH suggested, it's time for chain gear/VVT inspection.  The static angle shouldn't move around from one day to the next. 


2007 ED30 | 2009 TDI 140